It’s not Independence Day for Australia, just “Independent’s Day”. Anyone but the majors…
Election Tomorrow: How-to-vote suggestions for climate skeptics
CarbonSense have posted a list of dedicated skeptics in Australian politics
HOUSE
- David Archibald, Australian Liberty Alliance candidate for Curtin in WA
- George Christensen, LNP Candidate for Dawson in Queensland
- Dr Dennis Jensen MP, Independent Candidate for Tangney, WA
SENATE
- David Leyonhjelm, Liberal Democrats for NSW
- Bob Day, Family First for SA “No more windfarms”
- John Madigan, Manufacturing and Farming Party
- Malcolm Roberts, No 2 on ticket for Pauline Hanson in Queensland
- Dr Mark Imisides, Christian Democrats, WA.
Rafe Campion recommends the http://ConservativeRevolt.wix.com/HowToVote .
My method is to choose your local candidate carefully, based on individuals not parties. Know your candidates. I lean Delcon. Like John Stone who links to the list of Turncoats. There is no small government major party any more. Shorten would be more-terrible in the short run, but we might get a good opposition and a decent Senate. (Blessed are the Gridlocked, whose MP’s cannot pass laws.) In the long run Turnbull could stop us getting both good government and a good opposition. In the short run, the dire option of another Labor-Green government with some Senate control is still a risky possibility (latest IPSOS poll is 50:50). I don’t trust polls, but that doesn’t help. Predicting preferences in this election is a wildcard. Voters can’t vote for a gridlocked parliament, only for each candidate.
“Better to have a real conservative opposition than a fake conservative government.”
In the campaign, I hoped someone would explain how we can fix the Liberal Party while they hold power. No one did. But being in opposition didn’t fix the Labor Party either. The answer is probably in a long term grassroots movement that is organized and networked. That isn’t going to happen tomorrow.
The voters are going to surprise the major parties tomorrow
The new voting system will not work the way the majors hoped. It was supposed to stop minor parties doing tricky preference deals and getting in a senator “by accident”. It will not work. By getting people to number the boxes above the line, rather than just sticking in a “1” they are bringing the preferences concept to life. People will think more about their choices rather than less. Instead of wiping out the minorities it will increase them.
The “accidental senators” were never an accident — they personally got a bit lucky — but if it wasn’t them, it would have gone to one of the other small, non-establishment protest candidates. The protest vote was real, has got larger, and isn’t going away. All the talk of people winning on 0.1% of a primary vote was just another deceit that hid the fact that a large percentage of voters ultimately wanted any minor candidate more than they wanted a major one.
Both major parties have lost their heart and soul — deserting their bases
Australian politics is a parody.
Labor fights to stop plebiscites that would ask the workers what they really want (how bad can that be?). It rages for same-sex marriage, a topic that affects 2% of voters, and not in a life or death way. Labor tries to galvanize the crowd to change the weather in 2100, even though voters don’t vote much on environmental issues, and choose other environmental problems when they do. The party of workers supposedly worries about the rights of non-workers from outside Australia who apparently escaped death and tyranny but aren’t grateful for food, shelter, and allowances in safe locations. Labor lied about bringing in a carbon tax and hasn’t yet admitted it was the wrong thing to do or said sorry for doing it.
The Liberals have given up on free speech and smaller government. They are not even pretending. The ABC pours scorn on half of Australian voters and does so with permission of the Coalition. The Liberals won the last election on a blood oath to stop the carbon tax, but they tossed out the leader who did that, and a carbon tax started today. They tax as much as almost any government in Australia ever has, and enthuse that governments really can control the weather, stop storms and make floods go away. The Liberal Party cannot keep this up. Will they split, or will a new force arise from the forgotten base?
Curiously a couple of Bellwether voters I know, who only see mainstream news and mix in mainstream circles in median suburbs, have told me they’ve already voted and they went “totally independent”. They know almost nothing about Brexit. When asked why they are fed up with the major parties, the answer is “they both lie”. And some of them put the Greens last, after the majors.
The independent movement in Australia is immature, disorganised, not networked and not focused. There’s no Trump here, no Boris Johnson or Farage. Yet there is anger and passion here for the galvanizing. Who will do that?
I seriously hope people make an effort but I’m not overly confident, many have voiced their angst and even asked for a way but years of lazy voting has developed apathy when in the booth.
Australians can no longer take an ‘I don’t care about politics’ anymore, if they thought a recession or economic downturn was bad just wait and see what socialism has in store for your way of life.
Get in that booth tomorrow and have the courage of your convictions or never complain about politics in this country again!
240
Went downtown Broome this morning and voted ALA and National, surprised how busy it was. More than election day when I usually vote?
Thanks to Jo for being able to, and having the ability to, make it so clear to me. Good luck to Drs Archibald and Jensen tomorrow
222
Be careful voting for the ALA if you think renewable energy is a crock of s?!/&. They support renewables and phasing out coal, and government picking “winners” – always a terrible idea.
ALA policy:
111
The ALA also think that abolishing both Medicare and the “community rating” system for private health fees are really good ideas. Well, maybe, if you’re twenty years old.
32
ALA = ALA RMING if they support wind power
81
“Australia has enormous reserves of Thorium” translates into, Enormous quantities of toxic chemicals to process the thorium ore. Heavy metals released, and so forth,…
No such thing as a free lunch.
96
No it translates into fission reactors, get over it and get a life
181
True, but that’s no reason to starve ourselves to death as the watermelons would have us do.
140
Not for wind turbines either!
In China, the true cost of Britain’s clean, green wind power experiment: Pollution on a disastrous scale
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/home/moslive/article-1350811/In-China-true-cost-Britains-clean-green-wind-power-experiment-Pollution-disastrous-scale.html
90
At this stage, there is not too much wrong with the ALAs policy on this issue. I don’t think it is a major part of their manifesto at the moment and I don’t think they really understand the scientific issues involved. However, if the ALA gets up and starts to look like it will start going places then, looking at people like Kirallie Smith, Bernard Gaynor and Ron Pike, I think they would be open to education on the real state of play in this area. There are many of us on this blog, I am sure, who are members of the ALA and could help with the “reeducation”.
152
Exactly.
93
Obviously you didn’t hear Angry speak at the Carbon Tax rally in 2011. He reckons global warming is a fraud!
ALA are sceptics.
140
Any party that would install David Archibald as a candidate is not run by believers.
170
Correct Peter, consider we have been voting for the same two for decades and they have morphed into one deleting that choice.
With ALA we shouldn’t ‘throw the baby out with the bathwater’, wait until they get in before picking the crap out of them. 🙂
110
Making a sea change shift to a group because you like their policies shouldn’t have to involve “reeducating” them. That’s a conflict in logic.
30
I think that may have written before the steady hand of David Archibald came into the fold.
70
Having read the policy above, I couldn’t support them. The phasing out of coal was the kicker. These people have obviously never heard of ultra-supercritical coal power stations.
221
We should phase out coal, for a cheaper, cleaner energy source that doesn’t result in thousands of deaths due to its mining.
Unfortunately it hasn’t been invented yet, so coal is still the best option as it reduces poverty. Thorium has potential though.
The logical step is to upgrade the current plants to more efficient ones, with the capacity to harvest the CO2 for algal production. (which isn’t expensive like CCS)
10
I look at Thorium Power Stations (on a large scale) and I can see that they are still a very long way off.
I look at coal fired power and see that we already have HELE USC plants, and Advanced USC in the pipelines, a lot closer than Thorium is. The current USC plants offer what is really large scale emissions reductions, and Advanced USC is even more efficient than they are, hence even greater emissions savings, because they burn even less coal, and do it more efficiently, and can run huge units.
To me, that’s the logical next step, rather than waiting for Thorium to get to that stage.
I can fully understand that ….. ANY political party would not even mention new tech coal fired power, even with those huge emissions savings, because it’s a rolled gold, guaranteed vote loser, no matter how well anybody explains it.
Until there is a political party actually willing to get out and explain it so the people can understand it, then all we have is what we’ve already got, aging old tech coal fired plants virtually all of them on the aged pension now.
Oddly, the most up to date coal fired plants in Australia are here in Queensland, where we have five of the 8 large scale plants operating on Supercritical technology, one step below USC.
Callide C – 2 X 460MW units – Opened 2001
Kogan Creek – 1 X 750MW unit – Opened 2007
Milmerran – 2 X 425MW units – Opened 2008
Stanwell – 4 X 365MW units – Opened 1996
Tarong North – 1 X 445MW unit – Opened 2003
So, with a (possible) 50 year life span, the oldest of them (Stanwell) could feasibly in operation until 2045.
The Queensland Government wants to close them (five of the eight in total plants) by 2030.
That will never happen, of that I am certain, absolutely certain.
Tony.
121
“with the capacity to harvest the CO2 for algal production”
Sure, use what you can near the power station, but put the rest into the atmosphere WHERE IT BELONGS !!
30
Why bother harvesting CO2 fed algae, unless it is a profitable way of producing protein which could be used for feedstock of some kind. The phytoplankton, crops, trees etc. will use it if it goes into the atmosphere.
00
Thousands of fatalities? What planet are you on? There were four fatalaties across Australian coal mines in 2014 (a typical year). By contrast farming killed 43 people. Perhaps we should stop all farming.
00
I have never put even a quarter of the effort into researching candidates for any election as I have for this one.
Even so I am still fine tuning my choices, following reading the comments here, when I thought I had it all done & dusted.
The main thing I have learned is I don’t like Turnbull.
110
Pre-planning is certainly the way to get through the polling booth quickly.
Just list the people you are going to vote for and the group they are in for ease of finding them,
then slide the senate paper up one side of the booth and pull it gradually to the other side as you put the numbers in.
Easy Peasy. 🙂
30
second line should start… just take a list of the people…. etc.
10
Actually I found that very difficult.
I was swapping from place to place on the ballot paper, as I did not give all the members of any party my vote. Some were left out completely & some only brought in at about 18. I was close to missing No 16, when I tried jumping around in chronological order in the cramped space.
Working from my list to the ballot, I was having difficulty handling it to find parties.
It may encourage the donkey vote, but it would be much easier if parties are listed alphabetically, & house candidates were listed by surname, rather than Christian.
00
My exact situation too Hasbeen.
30
Do not be too optimistic – always remember the words of Einstein: “Two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I’m not certain about the first.”
The big guns will be out during this campaign, as they do not want to be humiliated like the British (and EU) elite have been. People are well-conditioned to seek the comfort of the known, which means that they resist change, no matter how beneficial it might be. The chains do not hurt too much if you do not fight against them.
https://www.facebook.com/anonews.co/videos/1260739457270944/
80
Then there is this: https://www.facebook.com/leaveeuofficial/videos/974528405978734/
00
I still have no idea what a “Delcon” is. Is it like a political air conditioner or something?
60
It’s political speak for an aircon eco friendly hybrid with a built in carbon module deluder.
150
Thanks Robert R. Guess i was on the right track then. Sounds pretty high tech.
60
It sure is
40
A DelCon is a Delusional Conservative. Translates as a Liberal who thinks Turnbull is further left than Shorten.
170
I am a DelCon.
I did not want to be a DelCon, but Chairman Mal made me do it.
Today, I have voted as a DelCon.
70
Its clear that many Australians feel disenfranchised by the political establishment and elite and will not vote with any enthusiasm , it must be frustrating to say the least to watch from the stands what is happening in the states and here in the UK , but you can still make a difference with a protest vote against the two main parties , someone of note will then step up from the election wreckage, that speaks for you and acts as a figurehead for you to form a movement for change that you can gather around , maybe an independent Tony Abbot free from his party restraints and able to say what he thinks , anyway all the very best to you tomorrow ,hope something positive will come out of it one way or another
160
Tony Abbott is the long shadow over this election. In fact Abbott would have romped home against Shorten and everyone knows it. Malcolm’s Liberals tried desperately to remove him at preselection, as they did so many others like Jensen and Bishop. Malcolm claimed he was the saviour, the great communicator, the one to lead them home and he has done absolutely nothing except prepare the way for Malcolm’s Liberals, a new party with no Liberal credentials at all.
However if Malcolm trips up, he has set the precedent for his rapid removal and the Delcons will show no mercy. It would be justice if Malcolm was thrown out by Tony, which will certainly happen if Malcolm loses tomorrow. It may happen anyway. Many voted for Malcolm because they were convinced by his ceaseless ABC campaign as Communications Minister that Tony was unelectable despite his landslide victory and too many Liberal MPs were too cowardly to stand up. Most of those are now gone, untrusted by both sides. He may yet be PM if Malcolm swings hard left, as he has promised every journalist and his ABC.
The one thing is certain though, the Senate will be a mess despite and perhaps because of a double dissolution. This time you only need 1/12 or 8.33% to get a seat, lowering the barrier dramatically.
Then nothing short of a Gillard style deal with the Greens and independents in the Senate will save Turnbull’s government.
241
I voted today. The new system is great. I voted below the line for about 50 candidates until only the scummy dregs were left (the last 90- 100 or so candidates, including Hinch, Sustainable Australia, Etc). I didn’t need to “think” about whether to preference greens or socialist alliance last*, I just didn’t give either a chance of getting my vote.
And it was really easy to preference Turnbull supporters right down the bottom of the pile.
The voting booths are so awkward. The senate paper has to be folded twice to fit in the booth.
* How do you make a choice like that anyway?
190
One solution to that problem is to develop a set of policies, maybe with several options, and try to get an independent to indicate which ones they support. Vote for the ones that embrace that idea, indicating that they see their role as implementing the wishes of the people.
For example, it should be relatively easy to develop a simple and highly popular energy policy, based on business as usual, mainly coal and gas generation, anyone can have solar, but they have to pay for it themselves.
70
Libs must be worried about Abbott supporters. You know, those who are loyal conservatives. Got a flyer in the mail with Tony’s face on it. Right on election eve. Good to see his face again. https://eyesonbrowne.wordpress.com/2016/07/01/libs-worried-about-abbott-supporters/
160
i just want the tennis to start, so am keeping track on the Guardian Live blog, simply because it was the first Live blog link that came up.
am enjoying their latest post:
26 mins ago: Still the rain pours. Fans are milling past the press centre here, holding umbrellas and wearing anoraks and grim expressions. Call this summer? This country wouldn’t know summer if it came up to it and administered a well-deserved kick up the backside! Enough of this rain. Can’t we call a referendum about this or something?…
70
Well, it’s because all the thousands of wind turbines in GB have done such a good job in reversing the global warming TG.
150
Mikky:
That’s why in the last Parliament 25% voted for neither major party and 12.5% of Senators were elected from those votes. The major parties were aghast! How dare people think democracy mean that they could vote for their choice, hence the new voting rules.
70
That was a reply to No.6. How did it get here?
For that matter how did some of those in parliament get there?
40
Robert R:
Or perhaps those wind turbines got out of phase and acting as giant fans blew all the good weather away.
50
Yes, that’s what I was thinking and all that infra-sound and vibration from the wind turbines is also upsetting the middle ears of all the tennis players, making it a lot harder for them to play. It’s like when those dam tourist joy flight helicopters keep coming over every few minutes.
60
At least it’s not snowing.
30
Yet!
30
just when u think democracy can’t get any weirder…
30 Jun: UK Express: Patrick Christys: Europhile Tony Blair launches thinly-veiled plea to be Britain’s Brexit negotiator
The former Prime Minister declared it would not be right for a Eurosceptic “Brexit Minister” to play a part in the talks to determine the terms of Britain’s EU exit…
The 63-year-old said: “There is going to be a negotiation of extraordinary complexity where there are a thousand devils in every detail… This needs serious statesmanship.”
Instead, he said the lead negotiator must have a “high level sense… of the things that might be compromised, the things that are red lines”.
He added: “The psychology of the other 27 countries is crucial to feel and shape.”
Blair condemned Nigel Farage’s mocking outburst in the European Parliament earlier this week, in which he blasted other MEPs, telling them: “Most of you have never had a proper job in your lives.”
He warned the Government not to “underestimate the damage” the comments have caused to relations in Brussels.
Blair, who tried and failed to run for EU President in 2009, is a committed Europhile.
He told the Telegraph:“Britain should keep all our options open but added that “it is not an argument for another referendum”.
“Actually the people do have a right to change their mind, but that is not for now.”
In a final offer to help, Blair said: “Our nation is in peril. To allow us to come safely through this we need to be adult in our politics, to proceed with calm, maturity and without bitterness; because our future as a nation in the world and as the UK itself is at stake.”
http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/685132/Tony-Blair-help-EU-Brexit-negotiations-politics-European-Union
anyone who followed the Austrian postal vote saga knows Austrians did not elect Van der Bellen, who “supports green and social liberal policies… & is supportive of the European Union and advocates European federalism” – Wikipedia.
1 Jul: Breitbart: Oliver JJ Lane: Austria presidential vote annulled after “serious” postal vote fraud
Austria’s Constitutional court has today ordered May’s presidential election be annulled and another called after “particularly serious cases” of voting fraud were detected in the photo-finish vote.
The Green party-backed candidate Alexander Van der Bellen originally snatched victory by a mere 0.6 per cent in the second round vote, which was taken to decide the new president of central-European state Austria in May…
Now the Austrian Constitutional court has upheld a complaint by the FPO about conduct in the election. The party had alleged that there were voting “irregularities” in 94 of the 117 total electoral constituencies in the country, reports Kronen Zeitung.
It is not known how many of the 94 areas alleged to have voting irregularities have been investigated, but the court identified “20 particularly serious cases” after interviewing 67 witnesses…
The allegation is that in these areas the postal ballots were opened and sorted before the arrival of Electoral Commission arrivals, meaning they could have been easily tampered with…
Given that the election was carried by just 30,863 votes, and up to 740,000 postal votes are in question the Constitutional court has now ruled the vote should be re-run, although the date for this has not yet been announced. Until the new vote in Autumn, the role of Austria’s Presidency will be fulfilled by a three-member National President Council (Prasidium des Nationalrats) — on which the FPO presidential candidate Norbert Hofer already sits…
Breitbart London reported in May that Freedom party secretary Herbert Kickl had spoken out before the vote over the “unusually high number” of postal ballots requested. He warned at the time that “[postal votes] repeatedly show inconsistencies”.
The decision comes just seven days before Green-backed candidate Alexander Van der Bellen was due to be officially sworn in as President of Austria…
Hofer, who initially told press his party would not be contesting the elections despite the close vote before the serious voting problems became apparent, campaigned on his Euroscepticism and opposition to mass migration to Austria.
http://www.breitbart.com/london/2016/07/01/presidential-vote-annulled-anti-mass-migration-candidate-gets-second-chance-postal-vote-fraud/
Austria’s presidential election re-run could not come at a ***worse time …
Telegraph.co.uk-1 hour ago
80
pat:
I couldn’t think of any less reliable or trustworthy person to carry out negotiations for you (with the possible exception of M. Turnbull who might be available from tomorrow with luck).
50
Here’s the disturbing thing: (disclaimer, I’m in the US). “THEY” think we are stupid. Its hard to use ‘left’ and ‘right’ when speaking across cultures, but it is clear that a segment of what we call progressives in the states has becomes overtly uninterested in elections. They rule by divine right, as their new ‘church’ has as a primary tenant an “arc of History”, revealed to them as the inevitable future that they, self ordained, are required to guide us to. In the ideal progressive world, all the trappings of democracy remain, permitting the illusion of popular support, but there is no impact on policy. In this sense, climate change is a wonderful lever for possible change, for, unlike a great many other issues, it is relatively binary. Tax policy, trade agreements, education, social welfare, all are multi-faceted, with ‘winners’ and ‘losers’ in every approach. So one can push the pillow of tax policy here, and have it pop out there, with little possibility of even promising an eventual resolution.
Climate policy, by comparison, is pretty discrete. Either CO2 is killing us, or not. Policies undertaken are relatively clear, and usually reversible.
The debate here is different in character, as well. A politican can always pull out a letter from Mary in Peoria, saying the the abracabadabra bill has saved my life and thank you for voting for it. I have never heard a politician pull out letter from Maude that climate change killed my tomatoes so we need to stop mining coal.
It s tough for progressives to debate issues that the population they have such contempt for can understand so easily with common sense, if focused thereupon.
Jo I wish you the best of luck in getting your candidates to office, and hope for a little issue illumination that will spread to the rest of the blinded world.
130
Will be up and voting early tomorrow.
Will be placing Liberals third last, Labor second last, Greens last in both tickets.
Will then assign the other candidates randomly to fill in the blanks.
When I see that neither Shorten or Hillary are in jail, I know that our society is not worth saving.
All those people who died on the Somme, only to have it all end like this!
We are *crewed, but at least I can give the finger to our human garbage overseers as we go down.
200
Your preferences are identical to mine.
10
Whenever I read about Australian voting procedures, I’m reminded of this scene in “The Meaning of Life”
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pXw7LYWNi5E
Whatever magic formula you use, I hope it works out well for you Jo. Nobody deserves it more. I just suspect that it will take a while and possibly another PM political stab in the back episode or two (or three or four) before you really know what happened. Boy, is this ever complicated!
61
Bellwether – a castrated ram with a bell round its neck that leads the flock. Or maybe bellweather is a pun?
61
The context indicates that these bellwether voters are leading the pack with their all independant votes and more of the same will follow in future elections.
It doesn’t make sense any other way. 🙂
21
Richard, ahem. Thanks. Though Bellweather appealed to me. I knew someone would give me the right version. Fixed. :- )
20
The bell warns the shepherd that the flock is disturbed, on the move. Wethers are mostly castrated as lambs, before they develop male characteristics. We call castrated rams stags. I have never checked the dictionary.
00
It is really the pits when one has to vote for least worst candidates to run the country as politics currently doesn’t attract many people of calibre.
How many Labor members spent time at Eddie Obeid’s ski lodge?
80
Probably the same amount of US Democrat members that spent time on Jeffrey Epstein’s Caribbean island.
30
Whether Independence Day or Independent’s day, may it come out the way you want it when the ballots are all counted.
50
I’ll accept the outcome as long as either doesn’t have Will Smith in them…..
10
Be serious Jo, you really don’t think Turnbull’s pride would allow him serve as opposition leader.
60
Its EGO, not pride. !
40
He will do whatever goldman sachs tell him to do.
40
Thanks to Jonova for the helpful posting.
~ ~ ~
Note: There is a slight discrepancy between the two how-to-vote guides I have seen.
In my seat of McPherson on the GC, Rafe Campion’s guide above puts Pauline Hanson as #1 in the senate.
On the guide by the creator of stopturnbull.com, for the seat of McPherson, they put Matthew Canavan (Liberal National) as #1 in the senate.
In comments the administrator is questioned, and responds:
“My antagonism to One Nation is based on some of their social policies, which are ‘progressive’.
I am a social conservative and these issues are very important to me.”
. . .
Hmmm … more to consider.
30
Jo
O/T but FYI
Chiefio takes a look at the fine print in a trade pact
https://chiefio.wordpress.com/2016/07/01/ceta-canada-e-u-trade-agreement/
30
OT, but another steep drop in UAH global.
from +0.55C in May to +0.34 in June
Northern Hemisphere drops from +0.65C to +0.51C
Southern hemisphere drops from +0.44C to +0.17C
Tropics drops from +0.72C to +0.38C
60
whoops, link
http://www.drroyspencer.com/2016/07/uah-global-temperature-update-for-june-2016-0-34-deg-c/
30
Oh my dog, its falling like a stone.
‘This gives a 2-month temperature fall of -0.37 deg. C, which is the second largest in the 37+ year satellite record…the largest was -0.43 deg. C in Feb. 1988.’
60
Current rate of decline it could drop below +0.2 next month.
That would put it below the following years for July:- 1998, 2002, 2005, 2009, 2010, 2011 & 2014
The zero trend back-calculation could possibly re-establish by the end of the year, to 19 maybe even 20 years, stopped only by the 1998 El Nino step.
20
Remember
“”Think of how stupid the average person is, and realize half of them are stupider than that.” George Carlin”
120
I am off to vote when the polling booths open in just over an hour.
I have My notes and a prepared Senate vote chart.
Thanks to Jo’s post I had another look at John Magigan, because the Carbon sense web site says he is a climate skeptic. The John Madigan Manufacturing and Farming website says this:
I am not quite sure what that means. Perhaps some one here knows more. I will check back just before I vote. Thanks to anyone who can help out.
50
John Madigan gave the opening speech at Lord Monckton’s address in Ballarat 2013, he has always been an outspoken opponent of wind farms and Agenda 21’s intrusion on private property rights, the language used in that block-quote sentence means we should not stop trying to innovate but any renewable energy industry should try to survive in the marketplace like any other enterprise without public money.
He isn’t big on CSG either, even though I once spoke to him about the benefits of this he still wanted to protect the property rights of farmers above all else, fair enough I suppose.
61
The UK Liberal Democrats are totally brainwashed into believing CO2 causes global warming, but LD David Leyonhjelm in Australia is opportunistically opposite.
Not enough to convince me to vote for him, considering he’s against gun control.
A pox on all their houses.
11
I’d vote for him then!
https://chiefio.wordpress.com/2016/06/14/orlando-ideologies-guns-weapons/
https://chiefio.wordpress.com/2016/06/18/what-california-teaches-about-assault-weapon-bans-they-fail/
00
Bully for you, I prefer to live in a country where only the law enforcement agencies and gangsters have guns, the gangsters mostly kill each other.
24
Do you think Obama would hesitate in using guns on US citizens if they were not armed?, hell he won’t even publicly name the terrorist organisation killing US citizens on home soil!
“The laws that forbid the carrying of arms are laws of such a nature. They disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes…. Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants; they serve rather to encourage than to prevent homicides, for an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed man.”
– Thomas Jefferson, Commonplace Book (quoting 18th century criminologist Cesare Beccaria), 1774-1776
61
Switzerland then?
http://www.snopes.com/politics/guns/switzerland.asp
“Switzerland issues every adult a gun and trains them how to use it: Switzerland has lowest gun-related crime rate in the civilized world. “
80
Switzerland is civilized but the US apparently not.
http://www.npr.org/sections/goatsandsoda/2015/12/07/458815891/the-u-s-is-a-world-leader-in-gun-deaths
Get a life.
02
Got one. And you?
10
Slightly O/T but have faith. Give the polis an unexpected result and they will use it to justify something they were going to any how. But it allows them to blame someone else.
https://wattsupwiththat.com/2016/07/01/newsbytes-brexit-spells-end-of-europes-climate-obsession-germany-starts-roll-back-of-climate-policy/
50
Here’s their ABC’s forecast for wins and losses tonight. This will be Antony Green’s work. The Coalition could lose 5 seats in NSW and SA is a big unknown. Vic perhaps 1 win for Labor, Tas a couple of seats win for Labor, WA a couple of seats, Qld 1 win for Labor. Who knows. But the punters have Coalition as a strong favourite.
I think there could be a higher informal vote for the senate this election.
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-06-15/breakdown-of-where-both-parties- stand-by-state/7513614
00
Here’s some of the betting market for today’s election.
http://www.oddschecker.com.au/politics/australian-politics/australian- federal-election/winning-party
00
Sorry, this is a better link for the betting market.
http://www.oddschecker.com.au/politics/australian-politics/australian-federal-election/winning-party
00
Lets hope we get to see a bit more of David Archibald & Malcolm Roberts after tonight.
If the serial propagandists of the ABC ever gave them a platform it would only be with a bit of Anna Rose “I can change your mind about Climate change “inspired editing &/or followed up with a prepared scripted staged rebuttal from the likes of Ove the Confuser or some other SOROSBOT.
30
Yes, agree heartily Jo. They’ve abandoned their traditional voter bases. It seems to be a world-wide phenomenon.
https://thepointman.wordpress.com/2016/07/01/brexit-an-analysis-in-the-aftermath/
Pointman
80
1 Jul: MySunshineCoast: Climate change action revitalised
The Queensland Government is revitalising action on climate change, Environment Minister Dr Steven Miles told a Gold Coast conference today (1 July).
Opening the “Climate Change for Good” conference, Dr Miles told delegates Queensland was getting ‘back on track’ when it came to taking action on climate change.
“Queensland was once a national leader when it came to taking action on climate change. It is a shame we went three years without a plan because of a politically motived campaign by the LNP to ban any mention of it.
“And its fitting that on the eve of the federal election we are talking about climate change because polls show voters are more concerned than ever about how we are going to tackle it,” Dr Miles said.
Held at Griffith University’s Gold Coast campus on 1 and 2 July, the conference was convened by Gecko, a Gold Coast-based environment group…
“With an abundance of sunshine and solar energy potential, Queenslanders are already installing small scale solar at a rate of approximately one solar panel per minute.”…
Dr Miles told conference delegates the government’s climate change initiatives included…
•increasing the uptake of renewable energy in Queensland by setting a target of one million ‘solar rooftops’ generating 3000 megawatts of power for Queensland by 2020…ETC
http://mysunshinecoast.com.au/news/news-display/climate-change-action-revitalised,44543
30 Jun: NY Post: Adam Brodsky: The imploding cabal to criminalize climate dissent
New York Attorney General Eric Schneiderman and his fellow greenies are getting a lesson about the dangers of believing their own propaganda.
These know-it-alls claim there’s a “consensus” on climate change and what to do about it. And they believe that consensus is so broad that even prosecuting dissent would be a slam dunk. Claude Walker’s monumental crash-and-burn this week blew up that theory. Schneiderman and his ideological pals, from Al Gore to Hillary Clinton, would be wise to take note…
The climate-change “consensus” isn’t as widespread as greenies claim.
Indeed, the claim itself is just another attempt to silence debate…READ ON
http://nypost.com/2016/06/30/the-imploding-cabal-to-criminalize-climate-dissent/
30
SOLAR POWER ==== CRAP !
72
All the best to yous, whatever you decide. It’s great time for a pommy bastard to shut up, and reach for another tube.
40
Crack out the XXXX, then.
10
response to the partisan ads WSJ is running, criticising WSJ for their climate denial, & demanding a carbon tax:
30 Jun: Australian: from WSJ: Climate change denial finally pays Off, after IPCC report
by Holman W. Jenkins Jr|
http://www.theaustralian.com.au/business/wall-street-journal/climate-change-denial-finally-pays-off-after-ipcc-report/news-story/3872c83646746848cfd84968865bae9a
***hostile petition from the anti-democratic, anti-science mob:
1 Jul: WalesOnline: Martin Shipton: Ukip AM returning from holiday early amid storm over his appointment as head of climate change committee
Around 7,000 signatures on a petition calling on the Assembly to rescind the appointment of Mark Reckless as chair of a committee investigating climate change
UKIP AM Mark Reckless, whose appointment as Chair of the National Assembly committee investigating climate change has led to thousands of people signing a ***hostile petition, is cutting short a family holiday in France to attend its first meeting…
“It is unacceptable that this be allowed to happen and that this vital issue be placed so low on the priorities of Welsh Government that they are allowing a party that denies its existence to preside over it.”…
“Across Wales, coastal communities are being left to rising seas, and inland flooding is impacting communities all over Wales. Climate change is the single biggest threat to future generations in Wales and we can’t afford the prospect of backtracking on climate action”…
“The Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change – the world’s largest and most highly regarded institution working on climate change – states that science shows with 95% certainty that climate change is man made, and 97% of the world’s scientists agree.”…
In May Ukip made a significant breakthrough in the Assembly election, winning seven regional seats. Mr Reckless was elected in South Wales East.
Committee chairs are allocated to parties in accordance with the number of seats they win, and Ukip was allocated one such role…
Mr Reckless added that under his chairmanship the committee would take an evidence-based approach to climate change policy, as to all matters within its purview…
http://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/politics/ukip-am-returning-holiday-early-11556188
40
I take the view that if Labor+Greens win despite their pattern of behaviour over the past couple of decades we deserve to be taken over by the IMF. With the Libs in power at least we have a better chance of economic survival and avoiding becoming a basket case like Greece. I just hope the new Senate is more open, honest and friendly towards an LNP government if elected. Otherwise, we will be in an ever gowning mess and I would be a strong supporter of getting rid of the Senate once and for all.
50
The Senate serves a purpose, checks and balances.
51
The Senate
serves ashould serve a purpose, checks and balances.There, fixed it for you.
20
Socialism – the wrong path
If you think that you can help one person that is okay, if you think that you can help everyone then you are a fool.
Let people govern their own lives .
Stop trying to intefere with them.
Best of wishes Australia
51
Independence – Equals No Britain
Australians need to totallly severe all ties with England driven Britain inorder to gain true independence.
17
You referring to Her Majesty Queen Elizabeth of Australia?
Australia is a democratic monarchy. Long may it live.
There is only one republic in the world that has lasted longer than 150 years and that’s the USA.
50
Totally different from the EU and Brexit.
I can’t recall one instance where the British has tried to enforce regulation on us from over there.
30
My word, it was crowded at the polling booth today – masses of political party and action group volunteers trying to shove how-to-vote leaflets to me while I kept my hands in my pockets.
The senate paper was almost as big as the local newspaper and needed to be folded down 5 times to fit into the ballot box. I only cast 30 preferences as anyone or party that supported CAGW or carbon reduction or Malcolm Turnbull simply wasn’t going to get a vote from me at all. To put the remaining Liberals down the order did mean voting for some right wing nut bags but they’ll never get enough votes to matter, anyway (plus a right wing nut bag beats a lefty, greenwashed communist, any day).
Tonight will be interesting but longer term, I truly hope Cory Bernardi goes through with his threat to split off a conservative faction from the Liberal Party so we get proper open debate on policies and a clearer idea of which senate candidates are worthy of the conservative vote
110
I numbered every box below the line – partly so I could savour the opportunity to put Sarah Hanson-Young dead last
40
I didn’t consider that!
10
Meanwhile over in Tagney, the polling booth was bereft of labor representatives. They had Jensen (independent), PUP’s pups, the Christian Demos and an odious green.
The reason I voted independent is that I’m sick of the political parties treating themselves as the elite and walking on the electorate. Turnbull’s grab for the superannuation is only slightly less offensive than Shorten’s cynical and baseless “Mediscare” campaign. The people I voted for are more likely to counter the drift further into socialism that I’m seeing in the major parties.
To vote Liberal is to sign onto Turnbull’s agenda – won’t happen!
Cheers,
Speedy
70
A charming young lady who said she was 24, who was standing next to me in line to vote, asked if she could take a photo of me from the neck down. I was flattered, and could not but oblige.
You see, she was in utter disbelief that I would wear a T-shirt that said “I Love Fossil Fuels”. She remarked, wide eyed, on how like really controversial it was, prior to being severely, but politely and charmingly, educated for the next ten minutes.
She took a photo to show her ‘right wing friends in the fossil fuel industry.
I’m just stoked that she appreciated how radical and hard-core I am.
120
Can I ask where you got the t-shirt from?
I’d prefer a pro-nuke t-shirt but one supporting fossil fuels would do
40
You can get them here, courtesy of Alex Epstein, who runs the Centre for Industrial Progress.
30
Ok since we’re doing “This one time…at the ballot box” stories, I voted earlier this week but it was still busy and while filling out my 116 numbers I could hear conversations around me that went “How many boxes do we number again?”, “Whoever are you voting for I’ll just copy”,”Don’t know who most of these are”, “Should I do a donkey vote or not?”, it was a serious distraction trying to keep myself from answering.
Turtle keep an eye out for that young lady, if shes wearing a “I love Fossils” T-shirt you could be in with a shot. 🙂
60
Should have asked if she wanted to see your tattoo of a coal fire power station chimney. 😉
60
Good one, Andy.
40
‘a coal fire power station chimney.’ with a reminder that wet scrubbers are necessary for proper function…..
30
I think I’d better ignore that Yonnie!
I filled in all 116; phew, felt brained at the end of it.
30
Yep it’s a mission alright, Mrs Yonnie and I used pre-prepared numbers on A4 paper, did you do this or winged it form memory?
30
No Yonnie, I wrote out some crib sheets to help. All Greens at the bottom, followed by all Labor and all esoteric sounding types (artists, renewables and so on). The two Vic Abbott killers were very near the bottom too. I expect I missed some worthy people among the Independents but I ran out of time and energy to peruse their policies.
10
⦜⨕⦜⨕⦜
00
Can someone let me know when to expect the results to start coming in , in GMT please and thanks .
40
Counting doesn’t start until 6pm (EST) on the east coast
(9am over in the UK, I think that’s right, maybe?)
Lots of generally meaningless blather on the TV until about 8pm EST then, maybe a picture will start to emerge.
Maybe some sort of result will be known later in the night, depending how close it is.
Senate may take several days or more.
Does that help ? 🙂
60
doubtingdave
They’re be available at the AEC here http://www.aec.gov.au/media/
The booths close at AEST 6pm which is 8:00 am Saturday, Greenwich Mean Time (GMT)!
Counting starts straight away
30
Oops…. I looked up “UK time”, not GMT. 🙂
30
No, AndyG55, you were quite right; they are on BST, British Summer Time which is GMT + 1.
10
Voting closes in the eastern states at 6 pm Saturday Australian Eastern Standard Time so far as I know. That is GMT + 10:00 so far as I know. South Oz and The Northern Territory half an hour later, and Western Australia GMT + 8:00.
So many things have been changed unnecessarily in my time that I need to check to be sure, but that should get you there. Counting starts immediately, and some progress counts are available from about an hour after closing. Small rural booths often come in first. Postal and absentee votes may not complete for a week or more.
00
The TV networks give running commentaries. The ABC should be here: http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-06-24/abc-coverage-on-election-night/7540690. It appears to me that reportage there should be available around the world.
00
Because the senate voting system is complicated and requires a considerable amount of manual checking, the counting may not be finalised there for weeks.
00
Say, I was asked by the owner of the site where I contribute to Post a Thread following the election, and he told me it might surprise me how many people in the U.S. actually do follow Australian Politics.
I wrote an Introduction and I’ll be updating it every hour or so, with the most recent update directly under that introduction. I’ve made it a Sticky Post, so it sits at the top of our site.
I wrote the intro, and have added one update already, just a general explanation of the personal process involved here.
Get this. It’s only been posted there for a little under two hours, and there’s already 35 visits and counting, and it’s still late at night over there.
If any of our overseas readers want to follow our result as it happens, I feel sure that Joanne will be doing something similar, but here’s the link to my own Post if you’re interested.
Australian Election Result – With Updates
Tony.
30
thanks for your replies everyone
00
O/T , Anthony Watts has just put up a good post on the latest UAH V6 June temp anomaly. Temps are dropping fast as the el nino fades and it will be interesting to see Ken’s post based on this data.
I can’t get the graphs to load properly at Roy Spencer’s blog today.
https://wattsupwiththat.com/2016/07/01/spectacular-drop-in-global-average-satellite-temperatures/
10
It’s close to a 0.3 degree drop to the UAH for the last two months, at this rate it could be a whole degree by the end of the year. Carbon taxes working or La nina?
00
see post #19 😉
00
Two votes done for ALA in my family and would have been a 3rd if my wife’s citizenship ceremony had been a month or two earlier. After that – at least for my part – was Family First, a solidly sceptic vote, then others down the sceptic spectrum.
20
And both the major parties suck up to the US and support the stupid wars it fights for Israel. Neither is ready to say that we do not need to be enemies with Russia. Both are ready to sell Australia to China and Singapore. Neither is prepared to really bite the bullet and bring house prices down.
They are useless.
So I refused to buy a sausage when I voted.
01
6pm on east coast.
I am just glad the dirty deed is done now and so we are another day closer to an election in which there will be better options offered, whether by a reformed LNP or by emboldened minor players.
20
ABC results site link here.
Not sure if readers outside of Australia can live stream the ABC24 feed.
At the links under the More Results heading under that top graphic is an interactive map of Oz and you can zero in on any electorate.
Tony.
20
Tony,
I went over to your site that you listed for the AU election results! Another US-peon interested. Thank you!
Sometime after this election you may want to review your comments about the atmosphere and the use of the term ‘weight’ rather than ‘mass’. I know, when constrained in volume, or density, they can generally be interchanged without confusion. This Earth’s atmosphere is not so constrained!! The Climate Clowns take every advantage in the lack of peon-understanding technical details. This can only be countered by careful mocking satire of every attempt to further such promotion of confusion. Your 2.86 tons of CO2 for each ton of anthracite is correct if expressed as 2.86 kg CO2 for each kg of anthracite but is correct only if the added 1.86kg of ‘atmosphere’ is clearly pointed out each and every time! 🙂
The planets compressible fluid ‘atmosphere’ limited in volume only by the compressive attraction of Earth’s gravity. This compression counters the repulsive force of each gas molecule electron ‘cloud’, and completely negates the concept of ‘weight’ or ‘heaviness’ for any part or all of earth’s atmosphere! If you drop a kg of atmosphere, it does not fall at all! BTW Your 388ppm atmospheric CO2 is 388ppmv and would be 500 ppmm in the troposphere.
All the best! -will-
00
After some thought in the polling booth in SA I decided to vote Senator Huff-Huff last (No. 64) and down the Greens list counting down, followed by Penny Wong and down the Labor list etc. It was quite easy to keep track as I placed each party ‘leader’ lower in preference than his/her/its followers, at least until the last 24 when I had to think a little. But at least I made sure that my preferences didn’t elect the Arts Party, the Cyclists party etc. Nor do I think Nick Zenophon would send me a Christmas card if he ever knew what benefit he would get from my vote.
My first went to Bob Day, and if he doesn’t get returned, or does with an excess then my second went to No.4 on the Liberal list (David Fawcett) the sceptic, followed by Cori Bernadi. The scrutineers and the counters may have nervous breakdowns, and the Liberal party machine won’t get any money for a first preference vote, so that is the best I could do to disappoint Malcolm.
Standing in the line waiting (and afterwards for 10 minutes handing out how to vote Lib. flyers while the party member whom I know went to get coffee and scones)** it was obvious from comments that there was lttle or no enthusiasm for the 2 major parties. Nor may I add was the Labor bloke that happy. He commented on the green carpet in the Senate chamber as “the only green necessary in that chamber”.
** I am not now, nor have I ever been a member of the local branch of the Liberals. In the dim past in Sydney when Costello was saving Australia despite Howard ….. Indeed if it weren’t for Keating (as Treasurer), Peter Walsh and Peter Costello in the last 30 years Australia would be deep in Grease.
20
Thanks Jo – this information was very helpful to me with my voting. P.S I’m so glad to see that Pauline Hanson did so well!
00