Something very “seismic” has happened to our electricity prices.
Paul McArdle of WattClarity goes through each state looking at quarterly trends and prices, and remarks that things are going “off the chart”. We had some electricity crises in Australia in the last 12 months, and 2016 was a significantly more expensive than all previous years bar the major drought year of 2007. But ominously, prices haven’t come down in what should be a “normal” quarter. In Tasmania there was a crisis last year when dams ran dry, and the undersea Bass cable broke. But this quarter, prices are only $3.20/MWh lower than the crisis levels of Q2 2016 despite water in dams and a working cable to Victoria. Something has gone seriously wrong with our electrical grid and market. In both Victoria and South Australia prices are higher on average than any previous April-June quarter in the 19 year history of the National Electricity Market. In Queensland and New South Wales, prices are at the “second highest”.
McArdle goes to some length to explain that this is not “one factor”, which seems obvious and fair — Its the combination of the closure of Hazelwood and Port Augusta coal generators; the extremely high gas-prices; the lack of wind; the increase of intermittent renewables; and the way electricity generators game the market. But what McArdle doesn’t mention is that these factors are not independent. If there was more coal fired power there wouldn’t be such high gas prices, and if there weren’t intermittent, highly subsidized generators, there wouldn’t be as much room to “game” the market. If there is some ominous leap in electricity prices, we know from years of experience that a grid with a lower renewables input provides cheaper time-weighted average prices even though for some isolated, miraculous moments every day, using a cherry picked description, and ignoring costs of transmission lines and auxiliary services (like “stability”) we could say we are getting “free electricity”.
A grid is a complicated animal, and people studying small separate parts of it can make accurate but totally contradictory statements. What matters is the total cost of electricity over all, after the wash, the games, the crises and the subsidies are played out. The high gas prices have other causes beyond coal and renewables, but there’s no question that Australia had a cheap backup, it could always use coal, which would mean the high gas prices wouldn’t have to hurt so much. The renewables subsidies are pushing the cheapest electricity source out of business. There is an Easy and Obvious way to let the market fix this problem that the government hath engendered, but there is no easy and obvious way to run a grid off wind and solar and no easy way to control our climate in 2100 using electrical power stations in 2017.
Thanks to Paul McArdle for crunching these numbers. Even the ABC is paying attention now, writing both “Power prices are ‘off the chart‘ and there’s no relief in sight” and “Victorian businesses struggling with power ‘train wreck’ as wholesale prices triple since 2015“. Go to his site for the gory details.
If spot price outcomes through Q2 2016 were “truly remarkable” then price outcomes for Q2 2017 were off the chart
Paul McArdle, Wattclarity
In Victoria, we see , we see the average price for the Quarter break $100/MWh (up at $104.92/MWh) – a gut-wrenching level for the vast majority of energy users in what has traditionally been one of the more “boring” quarters.
In Victoria, we see that average Q2 prices have never been higher, across all 19 years of NEM history.
Saving (in this case) the worst for last, we then step over to South Australia where the time-weighted average price for the quarter reached a staggering $115.93/MWh, … it is clearly the highest Q2 average price South Australia has seen over the 19 year history of the NEM.
….
In the same vein as last year, the most important take-aways from this analysis should be:
1. That the outcome for Q2 2017 was even more remarkable than Q2 2016; and
2. That it appears that we’re entering a new environment that’s distinctly different from the years that preceded; and
3. That this affects everyone, right across the NEM ; and finally that
4. Those pre-disposed to draw overly simplistic “it was due to … [this one factor]” conclusion are unlikely to be correct, and could be dangerously misleading.
…
Historical average price not enough to start generators
Two years ago, the average Q2 wholesale price ranged between Victoria’s $31KWh and $45/KWh in South Australia.
However the cost structure has shifted dramatically.
“These days generators can’t, or don’t bid, at anything much under $50/MWh,” Mr McArdle said.
See: Wattclarity for the rest.
h/t David B.
More breaking news today Jo.
http://mobile.abc.net.au/news/2017-07-07/sa-to-get-worlds-biggest-lithium-ion-battery/8687268
The capacity:
Alert readers will have worked out how many minutes of SA wind power that stores.
Is there any environment snake oil that whetherdill won’t buy?
381
Hornsdale windfarm 315MW gets a Tesla battery 100MW (129MWh). So roughly an hour to charge it(on average) and an hour to empty it at full discharge rate. No price is given but Elon said if it’s not built in 100days from contract signing (not done yet) it will cost him about $50 million. Bargain:-). That’s appropriately$130/MWh lifetime ownership cost at mates rates.
171
And according to tonight’s news it will be partially funded by taxpayers.
That means people not on the grid are now going to be paying for the costs of running it. Sheer madness.
331
See my comments at the earlier Thread of Joanne’s.
Comment One
Comment Two
Tony.
242
Look on the bright side tony, the wind plant can now be considered a scheduled generator and thus required to bid like coal and get raped by the nem if the does not blow enough to charge it up
121
I might also point out that like lead acid batteries lithium chemistry has depth of discharge issues. You can’t discharge them to 100% and get good battery life out of them. This is why the typical mobile phone battery is cactus after two years. This essentially means that you either have to replace that hundred million dollar battery every 2 years or you need to limit discharge to around 20% which is the point at which Li Ion starts to degrade battery life – this isn’t a 130MWh battery, its a 26MWh battery.
361
It’s a wet dream by Jay Weatherill. His desire to get re-elected far outweighs his responsibility to the people of SA. He MUST be seem to doing something before the blackouts hit this summer. So expect more fantasy. At $500M spend its cheaper to pay the electors directly to vote for the ALP.
Jay has made SA into California without silicon valley. SA is now political hollywood, Pollywood.
SA is now a soap TV Show. “Days of out lives” without end. The soft talk of the intelligencia without any logic or meaning.
131
Thanks, Tony, I assumed you’d be all over this one.
I just hadn’t re-read the Goulburn thread recently, and this also seemed very on-topic for Jo’s newer story.
I’d just repeat a calculation I made on 11 March, before firm data on the deal was available:
The takeaway here is that every wind plant would require a commensurate level of storage attached to make a dent in peak demand, and 12 times as much to correct for a windless day. By itself, this one does practically nothing.
As you say, they are only going to discharge the batteries when the price is highest, so they might not bother to save the grid from going down if a storm strikes anywhere outside of dinner time! They won’t be buffering the variable output of wind power during the daytime because that’s not their business plan. The natural gas plants are still going to be the ones stabilising the grid!
Of course what little power buffering ability this battery has would be the same regardless of whether renewables were used to charge it up. i.e. it is enviro snake-oil which simply makes a good story amongst the goat-cheese hoarders.
230
Where have all the flowers gone?
When will they ever learn?
70
Maybe we should look at it as a Lithium stockpile… If the rare earths keep going up in price, one day it might give what’s left of SA a few bob to buy food…
280
Please note that, if this trend continues, there won’t be any food to buy. It takes energy and a lot of it to run a farm, plant and harvest the crops, take it to market, process the crops into food fit for humans, and deliver it to the consumer. EVERY step requires using massive amounts of energy to make it so. In a very real way we consume energy to live and thrive. If the energy is not produced, we consume lives just to produce a subsistence level of survival for the few who survive the process.
Words turn into ideas, ideas turn in to choices, choices turn into action. Actions have consequences determined by what IS with no necessary relationship to the words at front end. If the words, ideas, choices, and action are coherent with what IS, then all is well or at least correctable. Otherwise, things don’t work out so well.
What we are seeing here is the consequence of a huge disconnect between the words and what IS. The experiment to demonstrate my point is well under way. The ultimate end is determined no matter how many disconnected words to the contrary are used in an attempt to delay it.
This is well described in the old saying: “If horses were wishes, beggars could go riding.” I would add: since horses are not wishes, beggars go wanting.
The fix is as simple and as difficult as “Get Real!” It is possible to do so but I am not optimistic that it will happen any time soon to a sufficient extent to make a significant difference. The hand has been dealt, the bet has been made, the outcome is known, payment is due, and all that remains is to pay the bill. The bill collector is coming and the bill will be paid in full one way or another. The best possible outcome looks to be beyond grim.
380
The story of King Canute (or Knut, for the purists) came to mind, as I read your erudite summary Lionell. Your clarity of thought has been missed in recent times.
160
Why do you think this government is so hell bent on taking the illegal”Fire-arms”off the street?might be because they know that when the”Sheeple”wake up to what is happening,there may be some”Very”irate people,looking for some”Lying,Do Nothing,Career Politician”to blame for this mess,which they will have caused.
123
Wind turbines already get stripped of their copper cabling by creative thieves, what would stop them from hauling off a few battery packs…
190
Oh! I thought that THAT was only happening in South Africa! Here, we get thieves who hacksaw down traffic lights over the weekend, to steal a kilo or so of wiring. And don’t get me started on what happens to railway electrics…
150
You are welcome to come live in Aistralia. It is slightly less of a wreck than South Africa and we need quality immigrants.
122
Who knew when Obama said that if Africans couldn’t have cheap energy less “the planet boil over”, he also meant Australians.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fBE0RKbRbl4
60
It’s a good idea that they are installing Li batteries. The consequences for the Grid will be so bad, people will need to take some of that Lithium as severe anti-depressant.
40
So for all of that money it will simply equate to one third of a single hour of wind-power-equivalent when the wind stops blowing – is that gesture-politics, virtue-signalling or simply plain old-fashioned downright stupidity ?
370
The word you are looking for, is “innumeracy”.
Not on the part of the people who are promoting this “solution” – they are very sharp.
But rather on the part of the general electorate voter who will follow anybody like Elon Musk, or your current Prime Minister, who claim to have “the solution to the problem”, when all they really have is another smart snake-oil scheme, by which they can dip their hands into the public coffers, yet again.
210
At least, with the Whyalla steel plant rescued from oblivion, we will still have a local source for the rails needed when we ship the bone-headed pollies and bureaucrats who cooked up this mess, out of town.
50
It did give Jay a chance be on the stage as his hero Elon for the announcement. It was pathetic watching him smiling up in dewy eyed awe as he watched the great man speak.
80
You should have seen his face while worshiping Elon Musk. It was enraptured desire. He wanted Elon.
190
What is the term for a mutually parasitic relationship, I forget from Biology…
Elon wants his (the taxpayers) money just as much!
160
The term is “mutualism”.
101
Symbiosis?
160
Symbiotic relationship.
See my comment above. Both parties need the help of the other, in order to get the differing outcomes that they each desire.
130
I’d suggest marriage but my wife might read this and I’m only a Pilot Fish.
110
You just did and she probably just did! Well done.
40
He wanted elon to save his political skin is all, cost and usefulness be damned. A majority of SA zombies actually believe Jay when he tells them the rest of the country are out to get us. This move ensures his hero status amongst the bogans.
Jay has cleverly tapped into the king sized chip on the bogans shoulders here in SA, it’s a very entrenched culture that began decades ago.
231
” And Tesla boss Elon Musk is promising to build it in 100 days, or it’s free.”
Nice Gimmic. What’s the rush ? No mention of what this Guarantee is going to cost though, in price for the delivered product. Then as it proves to be inadequate demand for lots more of the same, backed by desperate pollies, will surge, so its important to have your product in there at the start.
200
Advertising gimmick – It is a code phrase for, “I already have one operating in prototype, and if all else fails, that will become the production model”.
200
Is this a new 100 day target ? When he first suggested the idea of his batteries a few months ago it had the 100 day gimmick. So now it official does the 100 day clock start ? I presume in the intervening few months he has been producing flat out in the US and now the 100 days just covers transport and installation —or maybe he had a warehouse full of batteries he couldn’t get rid of so SA ( and it’s gullible Govt.) is a dumping ground
100
I think the 100 days starts after the grid connection is defined. I suspect that it will take a lot more than 100 days to design the facility, get local planning approval, order the ancillary equipment etc. And if the CFMEU is involved in any construction, it won’t be completed before Christmas 2018.
90
http://www.smh.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/massive-tesla-battery-should-reduce-power-prices-but-wont-prevent-crippling-sa-blackouts-say-experts-20170707-gx6sg3.html
‘The battery is due for completion in December according to Tesla. Elon Musk famously promised to build the battery within 100 days of signing contracts “or it is free”.’
50
Reduce power prices ?? Has the Cool Aid consumption sky rocketed in Sydney 9 or where ever the “expert” comes from)
70
The article talked about how long the batteries would power 30,000 homes during a repeat of the total blackout they experienced previously. Can Tony, or anybody else, tell me how they would produce a synchronised AC supply if there is no spinning reserve to synchronise it.
60
His sales figures for cars are way down and he has indeed a warehouse full of batteries. This sales pitch is just a coupling up of a ship load of his car batteries, no wonder they are putting it in the bush, it is a fire and explosion hazard. The stupidity it burns.
50
Its worth pointing out this situation can not be an accident……
This is Technocracy in action. Its about bringing a country to its knees, so it can it can be put on a short leash and kept there. They know power is our weakness, so they are going after it ruthlessly.
Smart meters are another bit of the puzzle, then once the IOT really takes off, the NWO mob will be able to monitor and control you like never before. They can already see everything you see and read pretty much.
“In politics, nothing happens by accident.
If it happens, you can bet it was planned that way.”
– Franklin D. Roosevelt
160
All Labor now needs to do is come up with a Communist Party style of slogan. Like Gillard’s Building The Education Revolution.
Maybe: Building The Electricity Storage Election Stunt?
50
Whoo hoo! It’s worse than we thought.
80
My guess is this is not the last of either.
80
Nope.
Not until we are begging at their feet for mercy.
Machiavelli would be proud.
50
Most voters won’t care how the explanations are crafted. What matters is the percentage of their income goes to this foolishness. Seeing the trend in voting patterns, it still appears many voters have bought into the pay-more-for-less-save-the-Earth campaign. Perhaps when their energy bill exceeds their food and housing bill they’ll see clearer?
230
They will pay attention when the blackouts are regular. They really will then!
190
I wouldn’t count on that, either. They’ll probably buy their own “battery backups” for the TV set and keep on watching the mesmerizer.
120
I think Robdel is right. People will accept ruinous tariffs much more easily than lost service.
80
Wait until the first person dies on the operating table at a hospital, when the power goes out.
Then you will see the true anger ( and recognition they have been had by their own stupidity, too ) of Australians ….will not be pretty. Good thing all those new “hold for indefinite detention” and “snoop on everything” and “invade our privacy” laws exist.
Power is just the prod the NWO are going to use to harness but also provoke people to anger. The NWO cant really control a peaceful and dopey Oz population ( Ghandi showed that ), they need them angry so they can crush them and show ’em who’s boss……this is the space they work in. Any form of conflict is preferred because it allows them to control both sides of the fight.
People need to think along those lines, not that this is a series of unplanned events.
FWIW – some of the NWO writings talk of deliberately creating a nuclear “hair raising event” on the Korean peninsula. Perspective is everything…..
90
From what I’ve seen so far, most Australians appear to be blaming the high electricity prices on privatisation. Wow!
Reality will have to be faced one day, but the politicians are going to kick that van as far down the road as possible.
160
Tom R Hammer,
Well obviously the masses need to move to the next logical step and take over the means of production.
Private ownership must not be tolerated, all property is public property in the Sheeple’s Republic of Australia, and should be managed by collective decisions. This has to happen because as has been shown the world over when BIG Government takes over a socialist utopia follows, with personal wealth increasing exponentially.
or
Is it that the cold dead hand of today’s over-large government has already screw-up the market causing this massive price-hike. This over-controlled market will make everyone’s life worse as prices rise across the board.
110
That is not a bad idea. Perhaps South Australia could then build an intercontinental ballistic missile and fire it the general direction of America? As a call for help, you understand.
91
RW
“The Mouse That Roared” repeated?
60
You have fallen into the hands of The Wreckers. None of this is accident or incompetence.
130
Correct. This has been planned years in advance.
80
The worst thing about all this is that my wife not only doesn’t want to believe global warming is a scam, but she won’t even talk about it.
If a discussion starts about any of this, she will actually leave the room, rather than listen or give some input.
She has the math to see it is garbage, if she wanted to, but it appears her illusions are more important to her than the truth. It appears she won’t even countenance the possibility that such a huge scam could exist.
Would people rather continue to be conned, than admit they were silly enough to be conned in the first place? I don’t see any way past her blank wall.
120
‘Would people rather continue to be conned, than admit they were silly enough to be conned in the first place?’
YES. This is the biggest impediment to the advancement of the human race. A big chunk of the population can just not deal with being wrong.
80
My wife was like that too, although more disinterested than antagonistic. However, as each new piece of evidence (temperatures flatlining, BOM massaging, ice increasing, power prices increasing, etc) came along she gradually came to realise that we have a real emergency on our hands. She is a devout Abbott fan (as am I) and now that Tony is preaching from the anti-warming gospel she is a firm convert. She even gets me involved in acrimonious discussions that I would rather avoid with the few friends we have left . C’est la vie.
101
During, the Second World War, the existence of the concentration camps, was denied, within Germany, with the population being told that it was just foreign propaganda.
After the end of the war, German civilians were offered trips to visit the concentration camps, and were shown the living conditions, gas chambers, and mass graves. The vast majority of Germans who took up that offer, refused point-blank to accept what they were told and shown, and accused the authorities of lying at the behest of the English and Americans.
I experienced this denial first hand, at a party in Auckland where a German woman, then in her seventies or eighties, could not accept that her countrymen and women, could do such an atrocious thing to fellow Germans, irrespective of their religious leanings.
80
The phrase I always use is “it can’t be supported by science”.
This takes the personal component out of it.
Facts are facts.
I also say that its our responsibility to protect our grandkids , who will be greatly harmed if people don’t shut the cage lie-fest down….
20
Moncton did warn us – Tony Abbott would be removed to allow Turnbull to acquiess to his UN masters. It is happening just as he forecast.
101
And for some who swallow politician talk, closure of Coal fired power stations is a “commercial decision”, which for directors it would be, but ignoring that the reason behind it is government imposed penalties.
120
Two things
Charge and discharge rates determine how useful this will be and SA imports over 5,000MW from Vic each day.
128MW is a nothing burger when it comes to statewide grid stability and daily power use.
240
The incredible stupidity of all this is so inexcusable.
The key factors for planning an optimum NEM have been well known for decades in the broad sense and easily calculated for tighter economic analysis of particular cases.
When I was a kid, there was only one type of milk, full cream, straight from the cow and yummy and wholesome.
Now in the supermarket, these is a score or more of milk variants, with expensive packing and advertising. Some of it is so processed that it hardly tastes like milk.
I see the evolution under ideology of the NEM as analogous to milk. If only they had left it alone it would be simpler, cheaper and probably better. It has been thoroughly messed up by incompetents posing as experts. Resign, resign, it is the only honourable option. You who have done this know who you are.
Geoff
Geoff
240
Welcome to The Casino. In a world where everything is a `commodity’ and it’s distribution is handled by `markets.’ Artificial markets are special markets, such as electricty wholesale markets. They are open to only a very few entities, namely the generators, and so are nowhere nearly large enough in terms of numbers, to behave as a real market should. When all members of a market have a common aim—maximising profit—and the means to make the `market’s’ supplies scarce, then you have a casino at the best of it and a monopolistic cartel at the worst.
Electricity should be treated as a natural resource, not a privately made `good.’ All the electricity generators should be publicly owned and the transmission method (usually a `grid’) should be part of the overall system and be in public ownership. That’s how it was. It’s a monopoly, yes, and a single supplier is the most efficient way to handle it. Therefore that supplier, and all facets of that production and distribution, must be publicly owned. It is constrained this way to minimise losses and maximise efficiency which is why it was set up the way it was. There is a single Transmission Grid. That sets the monopoly status and the requirement for single ownership of the generators.
That way, electricity is produced and sold as a metered service to all, for industry, commerce and domestic supply, for the benefit of the whole community as it used to be, rather than the product of the Casino and for the benefit of the generator owner(s).
Produced and distributed as a service, there is no room for maximising profit nor income through `gaming’ or gambling on an artificial market. The American utilities are highly regulated for this very reason.
The Australian States owned the generators and their own grid. There was no casting of the dice. Then they were sold off. There are far too few to make anything like a competitive market. Instead there is a cartel throwing the dice amongst themselves.
In NZ, we have about 52% of generation is hydro. Towards the end of the wet season, we had water being
dumped from dams to raise the spot price of hydro power on the `wholesale market.’ The timing of the dumps were at the end of the wet season and just before the start of the dry season. Guess what? Yep, high spot prices.
Artificial markets are not truly open, and `cartel’ behaviour, with some gambling, is a result. Enjoy your newfound `cheaper power.’
201
In South Africa, we have EXACTLY that form of state-wide electricity monopoly. Please note that this is extremely subject to dishonesty across the board, which is currently (sorry) being demonstrated with the shenanigans of the ESKOM board!
110
In New Zealand, we had exactly that form of nation-wide monopoly. The electrical supply was run as a service and cost to the consumer, industrial, commercial and domestic, was around 7c per kWH. Industry could negotiate `bulk rates.’
Then the World Bank demanded an electricity wholesale `Market’ and the privatisation of the generation to create a `competitive market.’
Now we have `cheaper power’ at 26c per kWHr.
Been there.
Done that.
Stuck with it.
100
Very few batteries can discharge at their rated Ah (Amp hour) capacities in one hour. It is more likely that the rated capacity would need to be discharged over a number of hours. Also, the deeper the discharge of a battery, the less its service life.
252
David,
Stating true facts on the battery issues is not allowed.
The fantasizing of the Elon Musk’s of this world are most certainly allowed.
The CO2 horsesh*t has to stop.
201
David mentions this: (my bolding here)
Either way, all they have is 129MWH to get out of the battery.
That’s 129MWh for one hour.
If two hours, then 64.5MWH per hour
If three hours then 43MWH per hour.
If four hours then 32.25MW per hour.
Ecetera.
It only has 129MWH to give until flat.
At the maximum discharge rate of 129MWH for one hour at Peak power time, (4 till 8PM) then that is around 6% of the State’s requirement, so less percentage if that time foe discharge is extended.
129MWH is the maximum rating.
There are losses going in, and then coming out as well. Converting from AC output of the wind plant to DC to charge the battery, and then converting from DC back to AC to supply the grid. The wind plant could supply DC to lessen the ingoing losses, but hey that’s another level of technology for the wind plant. When do they charge the batteries. Will the wind be there enough to actually charge the batteries. Wait for the wind to arrive, and it lessens the charge time, until the discharge time arrives. Then there will be days like a week or so back when EVERY wind plant in SA generated zero for almost 12 hours, in fact drawing power FROM the grid. In cases like that, will this battery be charged by the grid.
Keep in mind that at Peak power time this battery will supply 6% of the State’s power for one hour at max discharge rate, and SA total power consumption is barely 6.2% of Australia’s power consumption. This is a tiny percentage of a tiny percentage.
Tony.
321
You didn’t mention shorting-out the battery. That can be pretty spectacular. But it doesn’t do much for the maintenance of overall battery life.
170
Yes this can be terminal for a battery.
210
How will Weatherill pay for this? He’ll charge it. To our National Debt.
90
Check out national debt at http://www.australiandebtclock.com.au/
Its over $200 million more than it was 24 hrs ago.
60
Or claim that Abbott sabotaged it?
50
It’s my personal experience that it has a strong tendency to let the smoke out of everything to do with the short circuit, from the battery to whatever made the short circuit and even a few close objects.
You can even have sparks flying. It can be a Guy Fawkes and Independence Day visual spectacular.
40
It’s only a 100MW battery, so at a 129MWh discharge, it will only last ~45 minutes! That is assuming a 100% DOD. Which is unlikely! So maybe closer to half an hour’s power, and somewhere around 5-7% of SA’s power demand!it may put off a blackout, but not prevent one!
90
Rob,
Your arithmetic is back to front.
The battery stores 129MWh of energy and its maximum charge/discharge rate is 100MW, so it would last ~75 minutes.
Doesn’t alter the overall conclusion 🙂
20
Will the cost (from Musk), so far yet to be revealed include the DC to AC generation, or just the battery bank. Presumably DC motors driving AC generators with noticeable power losses. Then there is the issue of phase synchronisation with the grid.
To Jay Witherall “be careful what you wish for”. I think you may be getting something approaching a lemon.
100
Tony, I asked above , at 3.something, how could the AC supply from the batteries be syncronised to 50cps if the State goes down again and there is no spinning reserve to which to sync?
30
Sorry, “synchronised”.
20
It can’t be.
30
It will be about enough time (1hr) to power the whole state (SA) for them to watch the news (probably tabloid yahoo 7) all about klimat change before that battery runs flat..This includes the tv transmitters.
30
No, it would run the whole state (SA) for about 6 minutes at midnight and about 2 minutes during the day.
20
Lithium batteries can have extraordinarily high discharge rates. LiPoly go as high as 75 times their Ah capacity. So can discharge full capacity with about 10% voltage drop in under 1 minute. That is why they are regarded as dangerous. Airlines limit battery size to 100Wh for transport by air. The emergency starter packs sold for glove boxes have a battery weighing 200g. When new they will start a car engine about 20 times.
The LiFePo4 Tesla cells have relatively high discharge rates for that technology. They comprise millions of toy cells 21mm diameter and 70mm long. The rated power for the SA battery is 100MW. The rated capacity is 129MWh.
If charging and discharging full capacity the cycle life will be around 1500. The optimum DoD is around 50%. In that case the cycle life will be around 5000. In the current market an arbitrage of $200/MWh would be possible. So the maximum income would be 60MWh/charge times $200/MWh times 5000cycles. So it could earn $60M over its life. The budget is $140M so it is uneconomic on that basis. It is primarily there to help with grid stability. Its ability to ramp load immediately can help out with sudden loss of a wind farm for example.
Ultimately it is more hardware that has to be paid for and managed. It means power prices will continue to rise. (Although someone has suggested the finance will come from general revenue – or more SA government debt)
180
Those of us that have been watching this for many years have correctly predicted the financial impact of silly and feeble “renewable” “carbon free” power sources.
We have also predicted the impending grid instability. We’ve pointed out the serious life-safety aspects of unstable electrical supply. Even as this slow-motion train wreck unfolds before our very eyes, our government representatives are unwilling to put the brakes on.
I used to think that some sense would come to those in political power but now I have no hope. The train will in- fact wreck. A horrible crash it will be with much suffering and even loss of life.
I do wish to thank the Australian folk that are going to make a world wide example of how NOT to do it. Green dreaming meets harsh financial reality. I feel very sorry for the low income / fixed income population of AU but thank you for your sacrifice.
330
The Slow Train Wreck is happening faster than even I expected. It is looking like a National catastrophe.
New coal fired power stations are required now. How quickly can they be built?
I may have to have to move to WA because they are not on the Eastern Grid.
230
Yes Peter C here in WA we welcome you with open arms – we have reliable gas fired base load energy generation. We also welcome those eastern states manufacturing & other industries heavily dependent on cheap & reliable electricity to also move here. My god I am sounding like a politican – I am not boasting but I am a lot smarter than SA’s Premier Weatherdill – mind you it wouldn’t take much to be smarter than that “economy wrecking” ALP dude.
200
I believe that the majority of WA power, at least in the south-west corner, comes from black coal. But I couldn’t locate any data to backup this assumption.
30
Graeme # 4 you are right but the end is nigh for the Collie coal fired power station (Muja) – the incoming ALP WA State Govt will close 2 units of the Muja AB coal fired power station on 30 Sept 2017 & the remaining 2 units in April 2018. After that WA’s base load electricity will be almost entirely sourced from natural gas piped from the north. Of course some small regional centres will have RE (wind & solar) but they will be a burden to the tax payer just like in SA.
50
As I understand it 3 gas fired plants are going to close at the same time as the Collie coal plant. About 400MW of generating capacity or about 20% of WA’s total capacity gone with no replacement in sight.
I can not see a Labour government with a big budget deficit commissioning a new coal fired power plant, or even a gas one, so those of us in WA should expect electricity prices to catch up with the eastern states pretty soon.
We in the west are just as dumb as those in the east, except slower:)
30
dumb as dog s.h.i.t………..
00
I am sure that the Labor party will work very hard at blaming everybody but themselves. I don’t know if it will work, given the inevitable higher electrcity prices, higher food prices (look at a typical supermarket and its electricity usage) and higher unemployment as a result of industry (and retail) shedding jobs. I hope that they come close to being wiped out in the coming election; that might cause others interstate and in Canberra to start thinking.
121
Over decades that I have observed politics I have been aware of Labor keeping two sets of “history books”, the bad items are labelled Coalition and the good items are Labor, the good Coalition are re-labelled Labor items and the bad Coalition are highlighted as Coalition.
30
liberals & nationals / alp & greens……….
DUMB AND DUMBER !
DON’T WASTE YOUR VOTE ON ANY OF THESE AHOLE TRAITORS!!
00
One can hope that it’s possible to learn from others mistakes, but some people just have to put their own hand on the burner to make sure it’s hot.
130
Your welcome
60
Mark D.
A sad narrative but obviously well thought out and true. I don’t see it ending well unless something happens to change your leading politicians.
The USA suffered through 8 years of this kind of chicanery under Clinton, then it lessened significantly but was still there for 8 years of G W Bush, then it came roaring back and exceeding anything in the past and increased it by many times under Obama. We have been in a quarter century of rapid decline.
Ignoring the leftists news (which is fake news and dominates in the USA), Pres. Trump has made significant progress in many areas, but one of his most spectacular success has been in energy deregulation related to energy, recognizing the global warming scam, and promoting energy production. As a result of this and the oil/gas energy fracking revolution, according to AAA our national ave gasoline price is 2.26$US/gal = 0.60$US/L which is approximately 0.79$AU/L.
We are also now exporting liquefied natural gas (LNG)to Poland among other places.
The point is that we are recovering from a quarter of a century of decline as a result of having the right person run for president and enough people forgo the past, rise up, and elect him.
I believe the same thing can happen in Australia if enough of your voters will forgo the past and elect conservative (center right) political leaders. If you disagree, look to Venezuela as an example of what happens under Communism/Socialism.
110
The problem is, LL, unlike you we cannot elect a leader. Trump has blown away all the political norms and is doing what he believes is best for the US, In OZ we can only elect a party and those who are selected (by party power brokers) to represent them in each electorate. When that party is elected they elect the leader – we have no control over that. And worse than that, they can depose a leader who got them into power in a landslide (Tony Abbott) and replace him with an empty cloak (Turnbull, a UN lackey) and we have no control over that. All we can do is vote the party out at the next election, but the alternative is worse. Poor man, my country.
80
The Greens, and other Communist fellow travelers, should be given the blame for the train-wreck to be.
Naming and shaming them now, before the actual finale, will act as a break on their ability to dive for cover, and claim that they weren’t there, at the scene of the crime.
140
Check this out. The Guardian “long read” about “climate denial”:
https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2017/jul/07/climate-change-denial-scepticism-cynicism-politics
70
The Guardian is still living up to its Somewhere-to-the-Left-of-Stalin political traditions, I see.
Balanced journalism is dead. Thank science for blogs, and freedom of expression.
150
Thanks for the link, Rod.
Of course, that ‘just proves’ where and why it is all `going wrong.’ Another ignorant True Believer™ with no knowledge of science and it’s method,
It’s much the same as the National Geographic’s The War Against Science published a few years ago. The Nat Geo article was, itself, an attack on science and the scientific method. So is this.
It’s not even a polemic, except for meeting the theological aspect of the meaning of that word, (Ain’t klimate religion wunderfool?) it’s just an insulting, ignorant (no idea of how science works) attempt to soothe-and-comfort-the-masses piece of pure propaganda. The one new facticious argument in the piece is that of 95% of scientists. Maybe the author is acknowledging Cook’s ownership of the 97% of climate scientists© fiction.
The boy doesn’t appear to have done his research. I can’t even be bothered debunking his effort. I’ll let Already 285 Scientific Papers Published In 2017 Support A Skeptical Position On Climate Alarm at NoTricksZone do it for me.
With over 200 papers in a similar vein over 2016, and again over 2015, it doesn’t look good for even the 95% of scientists fiction. Oh, I know: it’s a count of all the Eng-Lit majors. 🙂
But it does exhibit the journal’s polemoscopic orientation clearly.
So, for the benefit of all the non-Eng-Lit majors:
Definition of terms:
1. facticious: (adj) Made by art, artificial, unnatural, affected.
2. polemoscope (noun) telescope or other perspective glass with a mirror set at an angle for viewing objects obliquely.
There’s the mirrors. Read the article and you’ll find plenty of smoke.
50
Also check out this article in the Guardian.
Most of the comments (97% 🙂 are even more deluded than the article itself.
The ignorance and religious fervour are spectacular.
10
Thanks StefanL.
The author of that piece should be writing TV `Comedy.’
A `Post-Truth’ world. Ha. Risible.
20
ah, well. Time to settle back and watch the entertainment.
Shall we run a sweepstake to see how long it is before that battery:
– catches fire or explodes
– fails to charge (goes flat)
– burns out (catches fire)
– fails to perform in any other way (count the blackouts it causes or doesn’t fix)
– does a Samsung (catches fire)
– becomes an environmental menace (hazardous waste)
– catches fire
🙂
I see it comes with a lifetime guarantee. Now that will really add to the amusement.
10
Nobody with any intelligence reads “The Guardian”.
It is just leftist trash…..
00
5 Jul: Sky News: AAP: Business SA looks to bulk power bid
Business SA is seeking expressions of interest from companies that use more than 160 megawatts of electricity a year.
It says the plan will only work on a ‘one in, all in’ basis so it’s important to gauge support from local companies for a joint purchasing agreement.
The idea is similar to one recently organised by the South Australian Chamber of Mines and Energy involving a group of the state’s biggest power users.
That plan was recently given approval by the Australian Competition and Consumer Commission.
Business SA executive director of industry and government engagement, Anthony Penney says businesses at all levels are hurting from skyrocketing electricity prices.
‘We’ve already launched a deal for small market customers and we’re now seeking expressions of interest from larger businesses willing to enter into a collective purchasing arrangement,’ he said…
http://www.skynews.com.au/business/business/sme_news/2017/07/06/business-sa-looks-to-bulk-power-bid.html
60
Yet another article that writes MegaWatts instead of MegaWatt-hours.
10
how to explain the following? the not-so-smart meters or something else!
6 Jul: CBS Chicago: Dave Savini: 2 Investigators: Mysterious Power Bill Spikes
Jacqui Briggs says her electrical bills spiked about 400 percent. Her usual $50 monthly bills have grown to as high as $247, she says.
In her 30 years living in her roughly 900-square-foot apartment, she had never received any bills even close to this higher level. She also questions how Commonwealth Edison (ComEd) could say her electricity usage increased some months by as much as 756 percent…
She had ComEd check her meter multiple times and even hired an electrician. All told her there were no problems.
The big bills lasted a year. Then, without explanation, the bills went back down to normal…
Renate Lux shares an apartment with her partner, and says the normal $40 to $80 electric bill spiked for months to around $800. That is an increase of as high as 2,000 percent.
Lux thinks it was caused by a defective meter.
ComEd workers checked the meter and a company spokesperson says it was fine. Lux says that cannot be because the small apartment was being billed for the same electrical usage as the neighborhood laundromat, which is constantly running machines and lights.
The utility did install a new meter, then the bills went back to the $40 to $80 range…
ComEd still wants the big bills paid — nearly $4,000.
“That’s ridiculous,” Lux says.
In the same building, another resident’s bills spiked, too. The owner of a 900-square-foot apartment started getting bills of more than $800 a month. ComEd says that meter was tampered with, causing the spike. The owner, a retired physician, denied this, but was billed, anyway, through his automatic debit account…
This week, CBS 2 received more complaints of unexplained spikes that also went back down without explanation. Most of the cases happened last fall.
The Citizens Utility Board is looking into these and any other cases…
http://chicago.cbslocal.com/2017/07/06/mysterious-power-bill-spikes/
80
This is typically an input error when there is a system change. It was common with Energy Australia when smart meters were installed. One example I have personal knowledge on was they customer was billed twice because there are two instances of the same meter in the system. Billing issues were/is a common problem with Energy Australia:
http://www.productreview.com.au/p/energy-australia.html
30
Whatever people do make sure that…………..
YOU NEVER EVER ALLOW ONE OF THESE SO CALLED “smart meters” ON YOUR PROPERTY !
Stop Smart Meters Australia :-
https://stopsmartmeters.com.au/actions-you-can-take/
00
A typical wind power lull in the Adelaide Hills lasts for around 5 hours in the critical afternoon/evening period:
https://climanrecon.wordpress.com/2016/05/07/wind-power-capacity-credit-in-south-australia/
so this battery is effectively a mere 20 MW, on the assumption that it works, that it can be fully discharged, and that it continues to work after many such discharges. In contrast, the unsung hero of SA, the Torrens Power station will be generating around 1000 MW during heatwaves, which have peak demands around 3000 MW.
160
5 hours? I remember around a summer in Adelaide around 1970 where it was 98F for three days and no wind at all. Not a breath. No airconditioning then. So hot everyone slept on the front lawn and woke up to find the street standing up. The houses were unbearable inside. The taxi driver reasonably turned up wearing speedos. No one cared. There was so little wind the sea at Glenelg was just a lake with a thin film of suntan lotion and it was hardly worth getting wet. No Fremantle doctor. No sudden strong Southerly change as in Melbourne. How on earth would a battery last a night let alone three days? Will someone tell Weatherill he’s dreamin’ as he takes Adelaide back 50 years in just 3?
120
Good point – will high temps der-rate the battery even more?
I hereby open the “Naming of the SA battery” competition!
70
The battered battery.
The botched battery.
The blustery battery.
The windless wonder.
60
wattsnotupwiththat
30
The Weatherill Elemental Assault Battery
for Assault and Battery by the Elements.
50
Weatheralls Folly…….
20
“If South Australia is willing to take a big risk, then so are we,” he [Musk] said.
“Big risk?” No-one said anything about a big risk. Musk doesn’t explain further. All we’ve heard is that he is offering a fantastic product that will solve all of SA’s power problems.
180
Weatherill is like a broke gambler at 5am. He should know when to walk away. Then he did date Penny Wong.
150
He put her off men?
61
Whos the father then?
20
I have no idea why everyone complicates this.
First you have to explain why the biggest and cheapest supplier of electricity in Australia stopped production. Hazelwood.
It is not old! It was bought on a 40 year lease and forced to close after only 20. It has been maintained like an axe with 5 new heads and 4 new handles. It just burns coal, a crime apparently.
In fact the month it was closed it was generating 98% of its capacity. I do not care if it is 1000 years old. No windmill can do that.
So why did Hazelwood close? Answer that and you understand everything.
There is not market. There is only government taxation and the RET and of course Daniel Andrew’s tripling of the coal price. Now we get nothing. No royalties. No power. Of course everything is now more expensive. That’s what happens when you close the cheap reliable power sources.
The same for the closure of Port Pirie and Pelican point. They could not make money. Why? Why when power has never been more expensive at retail?
Next, the Greens and Daniel Andrews want to close Loy Yang. That is lights out for Victoria, NSW, Tasmania and of course, South Australia.
260
I have explained how the RET works. Everytime you pay $1 to buy coal or gas or oil or diesel power, you have to pay $2 overseas. At wholesale. $4 at retail. For nothing. How simple can that be?
Please put Tony Abbott back and run an election on removing the RET. It is killing us. We had adequate, clean, free and utterly reliable coal power until the RET. Consider that even these awful windmills are bought with our money but are not ours. So we pay again. Plus we have to pay for home solar, bought again with our money. That is even when we do not want their lunchtime solar.
This insanity must end soon before all businesses are closed. Stealing from the banks is just the first step in the government takeover of our society. To save us? No. We are the victims of rampant greedy governments and power hungry bureaucracies and extremists, State and Federal. It has nothing to do with Global Warming. That is nonsense.
250
I agree on the RET and have tried explaining it to the average person but unfortunately the details sound so implausible they struggle to believe its true, that’s how effective a well designed ruse operates.
220
Ask them who pays billions for all the new windmills and transmission line. Hint. It’s not the government.
Ask them who pays the $8000 cash rebate for home solar. (far more than pink batts). Same hint.
Ask them why they should pay for someone’s personal solar output. Good question.
Ask they how the government actually forces companies to use wind power to meet their targets.
Ask them why these massive costs are not on their electricity bills.
Then ask them why Hazelwood closed. It was working flat out when closed. Sydney Harbour Bridge is twice as old. The Snowy Mountain Hydro is much older.
Ask them why Daniel Andrew’s tripled the price of coal.
Ask them why electricity prices are rocketing?
It was common knowledge that when Hazelwood closed, prices would go up 20%.
So ask them why Hazelwood would close if they could earn another 20% if it stayed open? Answer, prices would not jump 20% if they stayed open.
160
Even front page on the Australian, $3Billion a year goes overseas from the RET. It could not be clearer.
Worse, we pay twice that. Like the carbon tax it is, the RET is levied at wholesale and it is doubled. That windfall goes to the retailers and friends. Everyone is making fortunes, from the poor. People cannot pay for these windmills and solar panels for the elites. People need their jobs. It is a National disgrace on a scale unprecedented. All due to ratbag politicians. Moderate that.
190
Yonnie says
Just show them the FY16 annual report for Hepburn wind. In round figures, $440,000 for the electricity they sold and an additional $750,000, gifted, because they generate “renewable” electricity.
120
Bearing in mind that former Liberal PM Howard said recently that he is concerned about the developing energy crisis, and that the original trial RET should never have been raised above 2%.
80
I am beginning to believe even the politicians do not understand how the RET works?
That is one crafty piece of legislation. Originally the Renewable Electricity Act (2000) it has been dubbed the RET because
of later modifications. The % is simply irrelevant. It is only observed and reported. Politicians think it is a TARGET. Sure, but that is all it is.
What matters is the stick which beats people. Heavy fines. If you don’t buy your Carbon Certificates (LGCs and STCs). If not you have to pay a massive $65 a MHWhr This is now a joke. One big reseller dared them because the certificates were $90 a MWhr. It was far cheaper to pay the fine!
When you consider that by avoiding mentioning anything except ‘fossil fuel’, it means the tax on natural gas is twice that on coal, based on CO2 output. So at wholesale, $100 a tonne on coal and $200 a tonne on natural gas! Double that at retail. For nothing. It is not even a tax. It all goes overseas.
Worse, I suspect the politicians also think diesel is ‘Green’. Why else would Tasmanians be paying $5Million a month to rent diesel engines and Weatherill buying/renting 200Mwhr of diesels?
Possibly our politicians should be taught to read.
50
You’re right.
Sugar Mills where I live, have been here for over 100 years.
In that time, they have been modified, expanded, rebuilt, upgraded, modernised (many times!) repaired, renewed etc.
If the water and the coal are within reach, there is absolutely no reason why a coal fired power station cannot operate for 100 years plus, on the same land, provided the area needed for expansion and renewal is not limited by encroachment of Government stupidities. (Wouldn’t work in SA!)
Hazelwood had eight units. I assume they were more or less independent. That is, boilers, fuel feeders, coolers, turbines and alternators as one unit. Interconnected, obviously, but capable of being isolated. Each could be totally renewed over time. This must have happened already in it’s short life.
Hazelwood was a political decision, based on the fear by morons, of a minority, with loud voices.
140
It is well worth reading the Solstice/GHD report released this week by the Minerals Council of Australia (available to download from their website). The very detailed report compares capital and operating costs of different generating options, (distilled down to $/MWh) based on a notional but realistic base load 650MW generating plant. The black coal fired HELE unit comes in the cheapest with wind with battery backup and solar with battery backup coming a distant second last and last respectively at around 5x the cost of the HELE plant. I doubt that Jay could get his head around this stuff or if he could even be bothered trying, but the devil is in the detail and there is no shortcut. In the context of his announced hopping into bed with Musk he should take the time to study the detail because it projects electricity costs 3x what they are paying currently in SA for the wind plus battery backup option. This should be ringing alarm bells.
140
I was watching the Mark Butler interview on Lateline tonight (shown at this link) and even though the volume was up, there was this annoying noise coming from outside our home and it was interrupting the interview.
I went out the back door, and realised it was actually laughter.
Every electrical engineer and electrical tradesperson in Australia were laughing so loudly, I could hear them all from here in Rockhampton.
Oh please, pity help Australia if this ex Union Leader becomes Minister For Energy.
I have ….. NEVER heard so much bull$hit in all my life.
You’d think at least they’d put someone in the job who actually had the tiniest inkling af what he was talking about, but then Labor always did work on the ….. “whose turn is it for this portfolio, and what faction is he or she from.”
We’re $tuffed ….. really.
Tony.
252
. . . . . a$$ault and battery . . . . .
100
The Hockey Team is proudly announcing an Australian hockey stick graph: electricity prices.
140
With one major difference, the graph is accurate.
160
But it was still produced by counting annual growth rings. The growth in the annual number of rings in to the Australian Energy Regulator’s office! 😉 😀
00
I’m now a conspiracy nut. Grassy knoll, Building 7…you name it.
It’s easier to believe in sinister plots than to believe in humans in high office who are endowed with the intelligence of aphids and the introspective capacity of moths. Jay Weatherill cannot be real. He is a biological impossibility. They made him up because they’re out to get us.
210
I think you are being unkind to moths…..
But yes, you are on the right track.
80
I think you guys are being negative.
Just think …
traveling by horse or pedal power
romantic evenings by candlelight
the kids won’t be able to use the computer so they’ll have to play outside
or tend the fields so they can eat
locally and organically of course
Here in ‘Merika we have Trump now, so I’m glad to to see you guys in OZ will be taking up the leadership of our return to a natural pre-industrial state.
At least until Elon can take us all to Mars.
🙂
180
Better watch that candlelight stuff. That’s going to release CO2 by combustion, very deadly stuff. I think the only safe alternative would be naturally occurring fluorescence that did not involve radioactive materials. I’m working on developing the first natural, all organic, environmentally safe system of home lighting. It involves a patented process that utilizes plankton and glow worms. I still have a few shares in the startup company available if you’re interested in saving the world for the generations that are yet to come. Contact my brokers, Hill, Gott and Gaines for a prospectus.
170
Out of interest – anyone got an estimate of the cost from your own get set? Must be getting close to crossing over.
80
I believe from various discussions a ball park figure for electricity from your own diesel generator is about 60c per kWh. Won’t it be wonderful when we get to the point of having millions of backyard diesel generators running day and night? I imagine neighborhood cooperatives might be set up to allow better management of production and economies of scale.
152
It would probably be competitive now if bio diesel was used. Does anyone know how much bio diesel costs per litre
50
Unless used cooking oil is obtained for free as the feedstock, I can’t see growing crops for biodiesel would be competitive with pumping the precious fluid out of the ground.
72
I know someone who tired to set up a biodiesel plant. In order to make it anything like competitive you have to sell the soy meal after you have crushed out the oil from soy beans. You get 50 gallons per ton of soy beans. Then you need to treat with base to make it into biodiesel.
His biodiesel plant ended up catching on fire. I had predicted this, that conveyor belts running on wooden surfaces was an accident waiting to happen.
50
I had a neighbour who has since moved away who with the assistance of another retired person, a former oil refinery engineer, built a bio-diesel production mini-plant in his shed. He found that buying unused vegetable oil in bulk, a consortium of buyers sharing the cost and the oil, was the most economical as there is no need for filtering out particles that used oil contains.
He said, ignoring the cost of the equipment that all came from second-hand yards and was built with volunteer labour, he produced a litre of bio-diesel for 80 cents a litre.
And his 1980s Nissan Patrol with injectors, no common rail, and no intercooler or turbo, runs perfectly well on the fuel he produces.
40
If you want something in the 2.5 to 3kva range, and want reliability, then you are probably looking at Honda, then if you want pure sine wave output you are looking at 3 grand upwards.
With Robin motor and Cromelins generator (what I have), a bit cheaper. These and Honda are pretty much start on first pull.
I have my own home brew 12kw/hr stand alone solar to run my electronics (and 12v fridge if I need it during longer power outages), so I already have pure sine wave where it is required.
30
About three years ago I purchased a portable 3.5 kva petrol engine generator pure sine wave output brand new from Bunnings for under $500.00 … unknown brand which I cannot remember, and I am away from home at present.
It is rated for continuous 3.0 ova
10
Sounds like a Scorpion. They are OK at the price, but no where as reliable as the Honda.
10
More rubbish from the SMH claiming that this giant battery will power 13,000 homes for a day based on 10Kwh per day where do they get this information from?
http://www.smh.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/massive-tesla-battery-should-reduce-power-prices-but-wont-prevent-crippling-sa-blackouts-say-experts-20170707-gx6sg3.html
90
Just you wait, the next step in saving the world will be electricity rationing if higher prices don’t work. We are heading for an electricity drought.
70
I thought it had already been mooted that industry will be “invited” to cease production in times of heavy demand in NSW this coming summer – for a price of course, which we will all be paying.
None of this can possibly be happening by accident, no matter how stupid politicians are. You really do have to be dedicated to the cause of economic destruction to do this stuff.
20
With the deliberate destruction of our electricity supply we really are heading toward a Mad Max type scenario (US name of the first movie = The Road Warrior).
102
Your comment David, has more irony than is allowed.
Where the original Mad Max movie was filmed, a solar farm now stands.
“The sprawling solar farm – near the hills where Mel Gibson tore up post-apocalyptic highways as the Road Warrior in the 1981 movie Mad Max 2 – reached full production in October.
During construction, about 150 people were employed there, resulting in a $15 million boost to the local economy, AGL estimates.
Now, kangaroos occasionally outnumber the two or three people needed to run the plant.”
http://www.smh.com.au/business/energy/how-an-australian-mining-town-became-a-solar-power-trailblazer-20151221-glsks3.html
When they went back to film Mad Max: Fury Road in 2015, they needed to re-locate to Namibia for their post-apocalyptic world of “fire & blood”, as “unusual rainfall saw the normally barren landscape bloom into life.”
Mad Max: Fury Road’ film locations: How Namibia replaced Australia
http://www.traveller.com.au/mad-max-fury-road-film-locations-how-namibia-replaced-australia-1mcxrv
50
Wow! Thanks for that Mark M.
21
I heard on the radio that apparently CO2 emissions were down and this was supposedly a good thing.
Less CO2 means that there was less economic activity which is a bad thing.
Industry is shutting down all over Australia. That is the reason there is less “carbon pollution” as the anti-intellectuals call it.
So little power is generated by windmills that it would have little effect (and coal stations have to keep burning anyway to provide spinning reserve so probably no saving at all).
All this because of the lie of anthropogenic global warming and a fraudulent “hockey stick”.
192
To clarify, it is CO2 from electricity production which is down. Overall CO2 emissions are up.
92
Industrial output is down. Kangaroos, camels, sheep, people, bird, insects, trees and the oceans are all fine and outputting CO2 in vast quantities. Emissions. Socialism masquerading as environmentalism.
190
O/T But here is a demolition job of John Oliver’s ( US comedian/commentator) rant about coal last week
http://www.breitbart.com/big-hollywood/2017/07/07/rich-trzupek-real-energy-expert-destroys-john-olivers-ignorant-profanity-laced-rant-about-coal/
60
I love this part of the script from a Doctor Who episode whereby a hostile alien could shape-shift into anything it liked.
It speaks to that feeling about this whole electricity mess, that its just not an accident, but rather the answer is way more awful than people will actually admit to themselves.
The Doctor: How many rooms?
Amy: I’m sorry, what?
The Doctor: On this floor. How many rooms on this floor? Count them for me now.
Amy: Why?
The Doctor: Because it will change your life.
Amy: Five. One two three four five.
The Doctor: Six.
Amy: Six?
The Doctor: Look.
Amy: Look where?
The Doctor: Exactly where you don’t want to look. Where you never want to look. The corner of your eye. Look behind you.
The Doctor: Why does no one ever listen to me? Do I just have a face that nobody listens to?! …Again.
50
Those of a certain age will remember the early TV comedy series ‘Burns and Allen’ where Gracie would create some chaotic situation while George at prompt corner (late in his study watching the action on his TV) would look on with sardonic amusement.
That’s my attitude to this unfolding power disaster, what else is there to do?
20
Complain. Shop around for cheaper electricity. Half of what you pay is markup on the RET, doubling it. A markup on a levy for nothing which benefits you or even goes to the government. A markup on theft.
80
Complain? Fat lot of good that does.
My suggestion for the LCP slogan at the next election (as it is currently led): ‘We might be bad the the other crowd would be a lot worse’.
30
Complain to the electricity companies. The are complicit in this. It is pure unearned profit for them as middle men. In fact the head of AGL said it was the future.
“the CEO of AGL Energy, Andy Vesey, who said: “We don’t see anything baseload other than renewables.”
So why is there a problem?
20
“Australian Energy Regulator figures reveal almost 60,000 households are on electricity hardship payments and another 151,862 customers are on electricity payment plans.”
This is tragic. To buy windmills and solar panels for strangers! Plus a lot of cash for nothing.
90% of what they have to pay is government intervention on behalf of third parties. Electricity was 4c kw/hr from Hazelwood and they made a profit at that, if it was steady.
150
Who supplies the electricity hardship payments?
50
The taxpayers that supply the subsidies to the renewables that drive prices up and up.
40
We do
The river of money has no limits.
10
Now Batteries for the state of fleeing businesses ???
129 MWH rating ……yes that is at day 1 . After each discharge all batteries lose capacity .
In 10 years these batteries will be toxic scrap. And if they are discharged to 80% and deeper regularly, then their lifespan will drop to as little as 1 to 2 years.
Not to mention charging loses encountered with any transfer of energy. For lead /acid batteries this is about 40% . That is to fully charge a 1 kw battery, 1.4 kw would be needed. Off hand I am not sure what Lithium Ion and Lithium Iron Phosphate are, but no battery is better than about a 20% power loss,not to mention these figure degrade with battery age and cycle usage.
Also to consider is lithium batteries in particular, are even more sensitive to charging abuses such as would be involved with erratic power surges and fluctuations that are commonplace with the true b’lvers windmills . Such abuse could destroy the proposed battery system in no time.
Battery storage of energy technology is way behind where it needs to be, to be anywhere near viable for any major primary power storage !
Why are they trying to use a remote area power system to power an entire state ?
Only the stupid applaud it, while the shysters profits from it!
Even if the CAGW religion was accurate, these intermittent toy power rackets and subsequent tiny co2 reductions will do nothing, and should be more than obvious to all that they will do nothing.
Why do China and India get a free pass? Why is it okay that they and others can use our coal but we are sinners if we do or want to ?
When others (we the little people) are forced to pay, then any obscene and absurd scheme becomes a viable proposition. The shysters flogging this junk, have their fists in the cookie jar. It’s that simple.
Somehow, somewhere, the advocates and propagandists will be heavily invested in this scam.
It’s profit by extortion, and until something serious is done about it, this racket will continue.
150
Is there something else at work?
Last time I was in Sydney I noticed George Street was still choked by light rail construction, adding to the mounting sense of frustration of trying to get around the untidy but attractive city I grew up in. And because there is no confidence in the durable value of any means of exchange (even hard cash can now be flat-out cancelled, ownership of metals can be made illegal, as happened under Roosevelt) real estate has become a baseload currency. Result: more day-to-day living frustration, fueled by money printing and downward-manipulated interest rates. I’m not saying that frustration is new or that high interest rates are a blessing in disguise. It’s just seems we have the means and tech to cure much of our frustration but instead we exacerbate it by white elephants which are obvious messes before they are even built.
Now, I’m a bit of a conservationist and like things such as metro systems and even light rail if it has a suitable corridor. But “green” seems to have little to do with conservation. While we talk of a green and driverless future, car finance is threatening to be the next sub-prime catastrophe. Diesel, squeezed through the world’s dangerous choke points, has become a “green” alternative while we wait for the fairydust.
No amount of waste and mismanagement is enough for Gaia and her acolytes. Eventually you have to ask why. Phony promises about Mars and hyperloops/driverless cars whizzing us about non-existent solar mini-cities are supposed to be the excuse for soaking up trillions while life just gets more frustrating for those who want to get to a place of work or heat a room in winter.
Are we being prompted by all this expense and frustration (called “sustainable development”) to give in to globalism? Are we supposed to say ouch at some point? Then what?
90
All those futuristic promises are simply diversionary tactics to keep the plebs from waking up to the reality of the present. It’s an old trick used by various unscrupulous leaders in business and politics to keep expanding their hold on power and money.
50
asking the tough questions at theirABC:
7 Jul: ABC Nightlife with Cassie McCullagh
AUDIO: 1hr39min15secs in: Tomorrow’s news tonight: Adelaide Advertiser’s Mitch Mott
Cassie: guess it’s the hottest story in town. you really do have the story of the day.
MM: it’s all anyone down here is talking about. etc.
Cassie: Wow, we’re off and racing, for sure.
THEN ON TO SANJAY GUPTA ARRIUM PUMPED-HYDRO STORY
Cassie: Wow….that’s very clever.
MM: it is.
Cassie: looks like South Australia is now the State that is on the move.
http://www.abc.net.au/radio/programs/nightlife/nightlife/8669418
8 Jul: Australian: Paul Garvey: Arrium deal: Sanjeev Gupta’s steely resolve keeps naysayers at bay
Mr Gupta’s optimism extends to energy stability in South Australia, which has struggled with blackouts in recent years.
Arrium’s Whyalla steelworks, he says, should become totally energy self-sufficient through an upgrade to the existing cogeneration plant, which converts waste gas from the blast furnace and coke oven into power.
And another arm of the GFG Alliance, SIMEC Energy, is eyeing a potential pumped hydro scheme involving some of the old dormant iron ore pits near Whyalla.
The plan, Mr Gupta revealed, would involve flooding one pit with water, which then during times of high energy prices would flow into a second empty pit and generate electricity along the way. The water would be pumped back when electricity prices were low.
Such a scheme, he said, would be ideally suited to South Australia’s energy market. “South Australia has an excess of renewable energy at the moment, but what it lacks very dramatically is dispatchable energy,” he said.
“When the wind is not blowing or the sun is not shining there can be a serious deficiency, and we will be focused on dispatchable energy like pumped storage.”…
http://www.theaustralian.com.au/business/leadership/arrium-deal-sanjeev-guptas-steely-resolve-keeps-naysayers-at-bay/news-story/3705e595fa066e165881970ac4aa5850
10
apologies. SANJEEV Gupta, not Sanjay.
10
Pat
“Cassie: looks like South Australia is now the State that is on the move.”
Further downhill is a valid answer to that
70
My thought was ‘over the cliff’.
40
… around the bend?
20
21 Feb: Adelaide Advertiser: Nick West: Pumped storage hydropower could help solve South Australia’s electricity crisis
(Nick West is a senior civil engineer at Entura, specialising in hydro-electric power)
http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/news/opinion/nick-west-pumped-storage-hydropower-could-help-solve-south-australias-electricity-crisis/news-story/bc514907cad2b17add04741d18d3627e
6 Jul: RenewEconomy: Giles Parkinson: Gupta to turn Whyalla steel plant “green” with renewables and pumped hydro
Chief among the ideas is to better exploit “co-generation” – using excess heat to generate electricity, and using wind and solar power, as well as pumped hydro to guarantee a regular supply and to overcome, or even profit from, the costly price spikes when demand peaks.
Gupta says the company is looking to invest in wind and solar projects, upgrade the steel plant’s co-generation capabilities, and also look at pumped hydro opportunities using old mine pits.
“One of the great opportunities for Whyalla in particular is pumped storage. The mine pits that are now empty can be used to store water, and that water can then be used to generate energy when there is a lack of energy,” Gupta told ABC radio’s AM program.
“Whyalla is not short of energy …. it is at the moment but it should not be. All you need to do is upgrade the co-generation plant there and there will be a surplus in power.”
A recent study by the ANU identified 186 potential sites for pumped hydro storage in South Australia, including some in the Whyalla region. It noted that only about 400 hectares of reservoir is required to support a 100 per cent renewable energy grid for South Australia.
EnergyAustralia is currently undertaking a feasibility study into one pumped hydro facility near Port Augusta…
Daniel Walton, the national secretary of the Australian Workers Union, which as a creditor has been involved in the negotiations, says he expects GFG to build its own power plant to make the steel operations “viable”.
“The discussions we have had suggest there will be additional power generation …. using renewable energy to power the operation,” he told ABC’s Radio National program.
Indeed, it is becoming increasingly obvious to small and large manufacturers that renewable energy offers the best path to deal with the sky-rocketing electricity bills caused by the bidding practices of the major fossil fuel generators, which have seen wholesale prices more than double in the past year…
Daniel Walton, the national secretary of the Australian Workers Union, which as a creditor has been involved in the negotiations, says he expects GFG to build its own power plant to make the steel operations “viable”.
“The discussions we have had suggest there will be additional power generation …. using renewable energy to power the operation,” he told ABC’s Radio National program.
Indeed, it is becoming increasingly obvious to small and large manufacturers that renewable energy offers the best path to deal with the sky-rocketing electricity bills caused by the bidding practices of the major fossil fuel generators, which have seen wholesale prices more than double in the past year.
https://reneweconomy.com.au/gupta-turn-whyalla-steel-plant-green-renewables-pumped-hydro-62686/
20
G’day,
“only about 400 hectares of reservoir is required to support a 100 per cent renewable energy grid for South Australia.”
Surely they’re dreaming. I wonder how many powers of ten they lost in their “calculations”?
Cheers,
Dave B
80
The much delayed reaction of how Australians react to higher electricity prices is a testament of our lazy and care free characteristics. It’s not always really bad but in this situation it’s fatal for the economy. Either we all wake up and do something about it or we as a nation die. Even with this news of higher electricity prices I don’t think enough people have woken up as yet. Perhaps in time as prices keep climbing, enough people will react to make a significant change in politics. It may be too late by then to save the nation but at least it will be pay back time for the current politicians on both sides who have let us down so badly.
70
We keep making economies with our power usage in the forlorn hope of reducing our bill. Contrary to reasonable expectations the bill goes even higher. User incentive has been replaced by dystopian punishment.
A possible scenario, when only the rich can afford electricity, comes from The Goon Show script :The Treasure In The Lake: ” Come in and warm yourself by this roaring candle”.
60
7 Jul: UK Independent: Jon Stone: Climate change not an objective for UK at G20 as Theresa May meets Donald Trump
The Prime Minister has been accused of a “dereliction of duty” after revealing that climate change has been excluded from her top priorities at this weekend’s G20 summit…
Green campaigners reacted angrily to the Government’s exclusion environmental issues from its key priorities, demanding richer G20 nations follow the example of less developed countries committing to clean energy by 2050…
7 Jul: UK Independent: Tom Peck: Trump and Putin will miss G20 climate change discussions as they hold separate first meeting at same time
The timing of the meeting, which according to the White House’s schedule will start at 2.45pm, would mean the two leaders would be unlikely to take part in the working session on energy and climate change. Russia’s news agency Interfax said the meeting was at 3pm, UK time, which might allow them to attend the start…
7 Jul: Bloomberg: G-20 Seeks to Contain Trump by Avoiding Mentions of Climate Change
by Peter Martin and Jessica Shankleman
A section of the current draft seen by Bloomberg notes the decision of the U.S. to withdraw from the landmark Paris Agreement, while promising collaboration on other less controversial areas such as innovation, sustainable growth and competitiveness…
“This is about trying to contain Trump and not provoke him,” said Nick Mabey, who used to advise the U.K. government on climate issues and now runs E3G, a policy-research group. “This language would show that he’s isolated on climate change but leave him with a bit of dignity.” (LOL)…
While previous G-20 leaders’ summits promised strong action on climate change, the communique currently being considered doesn’t appear to mention the phrase, instead noting the opportunities for job creation “of increased investment into sustainable and clean energy technologies and infrastructure.” …
While the main communique won’t affirm the group’s commitment to tackling climate change, the section of the draft says that the remaining 19 parties will endorse a separate climate and energy action plan which will act as an annex…
The other heads of state and government from G-20 countries as well as the European Union’s leaders will affirm their belief that the 2030 Agenda for Sustainable Development and the Paris Agreement are irreversible, according to the draft statement…
Steffen Seibert, Merkel’s chief spokesman, declined to comment on the G-20 draft’s substance.
“Nothing is decided for now,” he said by email. “There are many options.”…
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-07-06/g-20-seeks-to-contain-trump-by-avoiding-climate-change-mention
7 Jul: CleanEnergyWire: G20 special: Leaders fail to sort climate issue on summit’s first day
The wording on climate policies in the final G20 communique was still not decided, German Chancellor Merkel told reporters at a press conference after leaders met to discuss the issue.
The “large majority” of G20 members expressed their commitment to the Paris Climate Agreement during the working session at the Hamburg summit, she said. “On this issue as well, it will be interesting how we formulate the communiqué tomorrow, and make clear that there are obviously differences in this area, because the Unites States of America want to leave the Paris Agreement, regrettably. And that – of course – plays a role in the discussions,” she said.
Before leaving the room for a bilateral meeting with Russian President Vladimir Putin, President Trump had taken part in the beginning of the climate working session, and had made a contribution, Merkel said.
“What the communiqué will look like and how the different opinions will be sorted out, you’ll have to wait until tomorrow,” she told reporters.
https://www.cleanenergywire.org/news/g20-special
10
7 Jul: TheAtlantic: Robinson Meyer: The Paris Agreement: Already Forgotten?
It’s unclear whether Trump will pay any price for leaving the treaty at the G20 conference in Hamburg.
But Lisa Friedman of The New York Times reports that the European effort to create a cordon sanitaire isn’t going as well as it did in Italy. At least four of the G20 attendees — Russia, Turkey, Indonesia, and Saudi Arabia — seem unlikely to enthusiastically affirm Paris, even though they all signed it last year…
Indonesia ratified the Paris Agreement last October, but in the absence of U.S. pressure it may decide that investing in renewable energy isn’t worth the hassle.
Michael Oppenheimer, a Princeton professor and longtime observer of climate diplomacy, predicted last month that Indonesia—along with Brazil and India—would “back off” their Paris commitments after the American abdication. Those three countries emit 7 percent of the world’s greenhouse gases today; they are expected to take a larger share later this century…
And Russia has many reasons to buck the treaty. Not only is it the third-ranking emitter of heat-trapping gases, and not only does it want to reward Trump and rebuke Merkel: As Mother Jones’s Rebecca Leber writes, Russia has long seen climate policy more as a diplomatic tool than as a high-ranking motivation. Though it signed Paris, it has not ratified it; and it helped to scuttle an earlier attempt at a climate agreement in Copenhagen in 2009…
([Former Putin economic policy adviser Andrei] Illarionov, now a fellow at the Cato Institute in Washington, D.C., also claims that Putin’s government believes humans do not play a major role in global warming, Leber notes.)…
It’s easy to shrug at this diplomatic hoopla. What does it mean if a group of countries publish another statement condemning Trump? But it has consequences for American politics—mostly because it has consequences for American journalism. As the journalist Brian Beutler describes it, the U.S. media is biased toward “new” news: “things we didn’t know before, but do know now.” This often means that climate change gets left out. And with no “new news” about the Paris Agreement to cover, many outlets won’t mention the treaty in their Hamburg stories—even though the American withdrawal remains a major issue.
And that’s a shame…
If there’s any good news this week for advocates of aggressive climate action, it came from Americans again. A recent Yale University poll found that 58 percent of Americans say that global warming is caused by human activity. It’s the highest level ever recorded since the survey began in 2008.
https://www.theatlantic.com/science/archive/2017/07/the-paris-agreement-already-forgotten/532902/
6 Jul: Vox: Almost 90% of Americans don’t know there’s scientific consensus on global warming
That’s not good.
Updated by Ruairí Arrieta-Kenna
A new report shows that the vast majority of Americans have no clue what the scientific consensus on climate change is.
According to the Yale Program on Climate Change Communication and the George Mason University Center for Climate Change Communication, which conduct an annual survey on what Americans think about climate change, only 13 percent of Americans correctly identified that more than 90 percent of all climate scientists have concluded that human-caused global warming is happening. (It’s actually at least 97 percent of climate scientists that agree human-caused global warming is happening.)…
The Yale-GMU report, published yesterday, is based on a survey of 1,266 adults from May 18 to June 6 of this year, and the results have an average margin of error of 3 percentage points…
Now, it seems this particular finding from the report has remained pretty consistent with past surveys, which means the Trump administration hasn’t dramatically impacted the public’s understanding of the consensus…
But the Trump administration does seem to intend to “perpetuate the myth that there is no scientific consensus,” his co-author, Edward Maibach at George Mason, told me.
And they both suggest that the red-team approach could end up sowing fresh seeds of doubt in the consensus. Whether or not the Trump administration’s dangerous antics will shift public understanding on climate change is still unknown, Leiserowitz says. More likely, he believes, Trump “can reinforce or strengthen the disbelief [in human-caused climate change] of many of his supporters.”…
Both Maibach and Leiserowitz point to another finding that offers a little more hope: 58 percent of Americans, the highest percentage since the surveys began in 2008, believe that climate change is mostly human-caused. Though that still means four in 10 Americans don’t…
So how do we continue to build understanding of the scientific consensus on climate change under an administration sowing ignorance and doubt? As Michelle Nijhuis wrote for Vox, it “may be possible to metaphorically ‘inoculate’ people against misinformation about climate change, and by doing so give the facts a boost.” That’s worth a try. We’re also going to have to confront the massive “crisis of authority” and crisis of our scientific institutions under the Trump administration if we want to fix the messy politics of climate change in the US over the long term.
https://www.vox.com/science-and-health/2017/7/6/15924444/global-warming-consensus-survey
20
comment in moderation beginning with:
7 Jul: TheAtlantic: Robinson Meyer: The Paris Agreement: Already Forgotten?
PLUS
6 Jul: Vox: Almost 90% of Americans don’t know there’s scientific consensus on global warming
the study referenced in the above comment:
5 Jul: YaleClimateCommunication: Climate Change in the American Mind: May 2017
By Anthony Leiserowitz, Edward Maibach, Connie Roser-Renouf, Seth Rosenthal and Matthew Cutler
DOWNLOAD REPORT
Funding Sources
The research was funded by the 11th Hour Project, the Energy Foundation, the Grantham Foundation, and the MacArthur Foundation
http://climatecommunication.yale.edu/publications/climate-change-american-mind-may-2017/
10
Let’s face it the govt know what’s best for us , that is until we tar and feather them .
80
Robert you maybe unaware that a recent poll showed that 80% of Australians believe industrial CO2 is killing the planet and our grandchildren will be forced to live in hell. They said that no matter what the cost of energy they are prepared to pay to eliminate fossil fuels.
Without fear of contradiction I can say that 80% of Australians are brain dead and moronic, so I no longer bother talking with anyone. This of course sounds conceited, but I don’t care.
31
I could believe 80% of politicians but surely not that many Aussies are that stupid , wasn’t one of those rigged polls was it .
20
It was the Lowy poll and its dodgy, still 81% of Australians think we should devote all our energy to embrace renewables and build the infrastructure to make that dream come true.
10
4 Jul: MalaysiaChronicle: KELANTAN PAS GOVT – NOT HOLY OR CLEAN AFTER ALL: HUSAM DROPS BOMBSHELL – STATE GOVT SIGNED 30-YEAR DEAL WITH BLACKLISTED FIRM
The Kelantan government has been urged to reveal its next course of action after Bank Negara Malaysia (BNM) had red-flagged a company which the state has entrusted to protect some 396,000 hectres of forest.
Salor state assemblyperson Husam Musa said that the company, Climate Protector Sdn Bhd, was one of four companies named in BNM’s financial consumer alert on June 23…
Climate Protector had signed a deal with the Kelantan government on Jan 9, 2017. The deal covers a period of 30 years…
“Will they (state government) cancel the agreement? Will they warn the public to not be cheated? Will they just keep quiet as if nothing had happened?
“Will they lodge reports with the police, Bank Negara or the Malaysian Anti-Corruption Commission (MACC)?” asked Husam, who is also Parti Amanah Negara (Amanah) vice-president.
Climate Protector is reportedly Malaysia’s first “carbon credit company” which claims to be in the business of “reducing emissions from deforestation and forest degradation (REDD)”…
Could the public become a victim?”
http://www.malaysia-chronicle.com/kelantan-pas-govt-not-holy-or-clean-after-all-husam-drops-bombshell-state-govt-signed-30-year-deal-with-blacklisted-firm/
background:
2 Feb: SunDailyMalaysia: Emulate Kelantan, says Malaysia’s first carbon credit rating firm
KUALA LUMPUR: Malaysia’s first carbon credit rating company hopes to see other states follow Kelantan’s move after the state gave the company 25% of its land mass for forest preservation and to reduce carbon dioxide (CO2) emissions.
Under the United Nations (UN) collaborative programme called Reducing Environment from Deforestation and Degradation, or REDD, Climate Change Protector Sdn Bhd (CCP) was given 396,000ha of forest to preserve the flora and fauna of the region.
The company, specialising in renewable and sustainable energy, received the project under REDD for a 30-year concession period with the Kelantan government…
“The size (of the area) is enormous, this is the first time the government has given 25% of its land mass to such a commitment,” (CCP CEO Tang Too Siah) told Bernama…
Tang said once the industries reached their quota, they must buy more carbon credits to exceed their current limit. “Right now, the company is targeting the European market.”
On the prospect of this initiative, he said there would be positive cash flow between the state government and the company, which was expected at 55% and 45% of earnings, respectively…
http://www.thesundaily.my/news/2147813
5 Jul: Yucatan Times: Climate change and corruption curb water supply to Maya communities in Quintana Roo
Climate change and insufficient investment in water distribution infrastructure have left the Maya people of three municipalities in Quintana Roo at risk for lack of water…
Now, the federation has detected the mismanagement of 200 million pesos allocated to the state water department, allegedly embezzled during the administrations of the last three governors, Joaquín Hendricks Díaz, Félix González Canto and Roberto Borge Angulo.
In the José María Morelos community of Kantemó, Fernando Uc Chan lamented that despite the fact his town sits on top of the largest underground river network in the country, water is out of reach for families like his.
Digging a well would cost Uc about 3,500 pesos US $190), far more than he can afford…
http://www.theyucatantimes.com/2017/07/climate-change-and-corruption-curb-water-supply-to-maya-communities-in-quintana-roo/
5 Jul: CarbonPulse: South Pole carbon market director to join BP’s China ETS team
South Pole Group’s carbon market director will join BP in Shanghai to help the company’s efforts in the Chinese emissions trading scheme.
5 Jul: CarbonPulse: Ex-Vattenfall emissions trader joins London’s Oak Capital
A former carbon, fuels and power trader with Swedish-owned utility Vattenfall has joined Oak Capital as the head of the London-based prop trading firm’s emissions desk.
5 Jul: CarbonPulse: Former Citi power and emissions trading head to join BCG
Citigroup’s former European power and emissions trading head is joining The Boston Consulting Group as a consultant.
10
4 Jul: ClimateChangeNews: Sick of waiting, poor countries prepare to fight climate change alone
Developing countries have been promised $100bn per year by 2020, with no sign of it arriving some are taking matters into their own hands
By Mantoe Phakathi
In the face of a likely shortfall by 2020, poor countries must simultaneously lobby for the rich to meet their obligations and begin to develop their own plans to cope with climate change, said Julius Mbatia, who is representing African civil society organisations at the (Green Climate Fund) GCF’s board meeting in Songdo, South Korea this week…
Thembinkosi Dlamini, Oxfam South Africa economic justice lead, urged governments from developing countries to reorient ***the whole of their budgets to prioritise the transition to low carbon development and adaptation.
“[External funding] is taking forever to materialise and even when it does, nothing will change if recipient countries policies are not re-created to be climate smart,” he said…
Dlamini said by reviewing energy policy in light of climate change concerns, a developing country’s energy mix could be realigned toward renewables. This means new foreign investments will favour that direction…
Donor countries are known to prescribe policy for funds recipients and direct them at certain technology that favours the donor countries in order to drive sales of their products, he said…
While all countries would have to commit resources to the fight against global warming, developed countries are mostly responsible for the greenhouse gases driving climate change, said Climate Action Network policy coordinator on financial flows Anoop Poonia. He added that they also have the expertise and wealth available to support their developing counterparts,
But donor countries have made their support conditional, he said, preferring to encourage investment from the private sector, rather than stumping up their own cash. In reality, many climate-vulnerable countries still lack capacity to attract or absorb private finance and rely heavily on aid to meet their basic needs.
Poonia said the rich world needed to provide at least 8**$35bn each year, as grants, by 2020.
http://www.climatechangenews.com/2017/07/05/sick-waiting-poor-countries-prepare-fight-climate-change-alone/
4 Jul: ClimateChangeNews: Universities in global south aim to end reliance on western experts
By Mantoe Phakathi
“What used to happen was that consultants from developed countries would fly to developing countries to do training and research on climate change,” said Saleemul Huq, director of the International Centre for Climate Change and Development at the Independent University of Bangladesh.
“The LDCs challenged this in Paris because we need to strengthen the capacity of our own institutions to do research and provide training at national level, a long-term intervention.”
He said it was shortsighted to pay again and again to import skills from developed countries when every country has one or more universities with the ability to train and conduct research that can empower its citizens…
http://www.climatechangenews.com/2017/07/04/universities-global-south-aim-end-reliance-western-experts/
10
I want you to look at something here, (and I’ll explain it for you) because the very second that this new battery plant delivers it’s first amount of power into the South Australian grid, I can show you how much it costs per MWH, and that delivery time will be with much fanfare, something which will be announced in advance and with much celebration, but you need some background to show you how this following exercise will be done.
This will only work for the rest of today Saturday 8th July 2017.
Okay then, go to this link, and this is the AEMO data dashboard for the five States on the grid. (East of the WA border, so sorry to all you sandgropers, but hey, I’m sure it will also be of interest to you as well.)
Okay then, when the site opens, hover your mouse over the ‘Electricity’ title at the top centre there, and when the drop down menu opens, click on ‘data dashboard’.
The site will open to the default, NSW, seen by the darkened tab at the top left there.
Now then, click on the tab titled SA.
When that opens you’ll see the current cost for electricity (spot price) and on the graphs themselves, you’ll see the actual consumption Load Curve, the lighter coloured dotted line, and the actual price change, the darker coloured solid line, and if you hover your mouse over any of those lines, two boxes open indicating the actual demand and the cost at that time indicated in the third box along the bottom.
Okay then, see that spike there and when you hover your mouse at the start of the spike, you’ll see the demand and the cost, and the cost one is the one I want you to look at here.
That spike starts at 8.30to 9AM Saturday, and note the cost there, $122.80.
The spike shows an (almost) instantaneous rise, as more power is required in the middle of the Saturday Morning early peak for the day, as more power plants come on line to accommodate that rise in actual consumption.
The rise actually is instantaneous, but because they can only have one cost at each point in time, then it has to be shown at the next half hour point in time.
Now note the top of the rise in cost, a half hour later, and that cost is $251.04.
Note that from that point power consumption falls slightly, during the usual midday ‘trough’ in the typical Winter Load Curve for power consumption.
So the cost per unit for the power being delivered by that plant is the difference between the two costs, hence (around) $129 per MWH.
It’s the same with any of those spikes.
The cost rises instantaneously by the amount of that new plant coming on line and then falls almost instantaneously to the new usually just higher level, dropping here because actual consumption falls away slightly.
Okay then, that’s the background explanation out of the way, so now scroll forwards to when this delightful new all singing and all dancing battery in South Australia starts to actually deliver its power.
Same thing really, the instant it delivers it first electron of power, the cost will spike to the cost for this battery, and then settle down to the new higher level, and we can work out exactly how much the cost per unit is.
Let me say right up front, it will be a spike up, and a big one.
So, when this battery power is shown to be more expensive than any other form of power, I only have the one question to ask.
How in G0d’s name is more expensive power supposed to make power cheaper
Mr bl00dy Mark Butler et al.I’ll be watching this, so I can tell you all exactly when it happens.
Tony.
121
‘How in G0d’s name is more expensive power supposed to make power cheaper Mr bl00dy Mark Butler et al.’
Well, today I came across an article about a man who had just become the first man to give birth in Britain. He was born a woman. He stopped taking hormones for a while and he located a sperm donor. Nine months later he gave birth to a baby girl.
I thought maybe this story might help you to find the answer you’re looking for . . . . .
51
joseph,
Nothing unique about that.
We have a majority of parliamentarians who have had that sort of upbringing.
Remember when we used to fear inbreeding?
10
BBC propaganda posted 5 minutes ago; Putin added to protest grievances! lol.
7 Jul: BBC: G20: ‘Difficult’ talks ahead as protesters arrested
Leaders are entering the final day of talks at the G20 meeting in Hamburg as officials try to bridge the gap with the US on issues such as trade and climate change…
Leaders at the summit are struggling to find common ground with the US following President Donald Trump’s decision to withdraw from the Paris climate agreement last month…
(Merkel) added that she hoped that the differences with the US would not affect the commitments made by other nations…
Demonstrators – who were protesting against the presence of Mr Trump and Mr Putin, climate change and global wealth inequalities – set fire to vehicles and barricades, threw rocks at officers and looted shops…
latest Reuters keeps up the Trump blame game:
7 Jul: Reuters: Merkel calls for G20 compromise as crunch climate talks start
By Denis Dyomkin and Thomas Escritt, HAMBURG
The latest draft communique sticks with language about the Paris climate accord being “irreversible” but removes a reference from an earlier version to a “global approach” that some countries felt could suggest there was a parallel track to Paris.
It also includes a new paragraph which says the United States will “work closely with other partners to help their access to and use of fossil fuels more cleanly and efficiently”. Some experts were skeptical whether leaders would approve the reference to fossil fuels, which would be a clear nod to Washington…
yet US only comes a distant fourth in the following!
7 Jul: Ecowatch: Lorraine Chow: ‘Talk is Cheap’: G20 Nations Invested 4X More in Fossil Fuels Than in Renewables
Climate action will be a major topic of discussion at the upcoming G20 summit in Hamburg, with some world leaders planning to confront President Donald Trump about his withdrawal from the Paris climate agreement. However, a group of environmental organizations proclaim all this “talk is cheap.”
That’s because G20 countries are pouring nearly four times more public finance into fossil fuels than into renewable energy projects, according to a new analysis released by Oil Change International, Friends of the Earth, Sierra Club and the WWF European Policy Office.
Data from Oil Change International’s Shift the Subsidies database shows that G20 countries provided about $71.8 billion of public financing annually for fossil fuel projects between 2013-2015, compared to only $18.7 billion for renewable energy. Public finance is defined as grants, loans, equity, and loan guarantees from government-owned financial institutions…
According to the report, the U.S.ranked fourth in contributions, with $6 billion per year going to oil, gas and coal industries between 2013-2015. That’s four times the amount that went to clean energy, which received $1.3 billion.
The top contributor to fossil fuel industries was Japan, which funneled $16.5 billion to fossil fuels per year versus $2.7 billion to green energy. China and South Korea followed Japan on the list…
Germany, which is regarded as a climate action champion, ranked fifth on the list …
https://www.ecowatch.com/g20-finance-fossil-fuels-2454377076.html?utm_source=EcoWatch+List&utm_campaign=bf78ae818c-EMAIL_CAMPAIGN&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_49c7d43dc9-bf78ae818c-85365501
Ecowatch links to:
PDF: 40 Pages: JULY 2017: REPORT: Talk is Cheap
HOW G20 GOVERNMENTS ARE FINANCING CLIMATE DISASTER
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This is out there but is important.
Dr Roy Spencer compares the latest RSS V 4 TLT dataset with UAH V 6 TLT. Note that both are well below average model trends.
Average model trends are about 2.7 c/ decade and UAH V6 trend is just 1.2 c/decade and RSS V4 trend is about 1.7 c/decade. Therefore average model trends are 2.25 times higher than UAH V 6 and 1.6 times higher than RSS V 4.
http://www.drroyspencer.com/2017/07/comments-on-the-new-rss-lower-tropospheric-temperature-dataset/
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AFP mentions the Bild coverage:
8 Jul: AFP: Trump versus the rest as violent G20 wraps up
“War, climate change, exploitation are the result of the capitalist system that the G20 stands for and which 20,000 police are here to defend,” demonstrator Georg Ismail told AFP.
German Chancellor Angela Merkel said she could understand peaceful protests, but demonstrations that “put peoples’ lives in danger, put the protesters’ own lives in danger… are unacceptable”.
But the influential Bild daily slammed Merkel in a stinging editorial, calling the summit a “debacle” for the chancellor ahead of elections in September.
“Of course the police did all it could. But the street belonged to the mob. The feeling of general security that the state must guarantee has ceased to exist in Hamburg over the last 48 hours,” Bild thundered.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/wires/afp/article-4676796/Trump-versus-rest-violent-G20-wraps-up.html
***MASSIVE AMOUNT OF COVERAGE/PICS/VIDEOS OF THE CHAOS ON THE STREETS OF HAMBURG
http://www.bild.de/regional/hamburg/g20-gipfel/die-schande-von-hamburg-52468244.bild.html
HOW ABOUT THE POLLIES STAY HOME IN FUTURE, VIDEO CONFERENCE, AND TAKE CARE OF MORE IMPORTANT MATTERS, LIKE KEEPING THE LIGHTS ON.
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http://www.news.com.au/technology/innovation/inventions/race-to-replicate-suns-plasma-to-harness-perfect-energy-source/news-story/cd91efb994953c733a553b765e1247bd
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The (Tesla) battery will save us money …..
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-07-08/sheep-graziers-given-one-day-to-decide-on-battery/8690840
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And no mention in the article of how much the graziers will be paid for housing it. I hope they are covered for anything that might go wrong.
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I recommend that the sheep vote, not the graziers.
We need intellectual improvement in SA.
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Just thinking about the logistics of the Tesla battery plan. Capacity is stated to be 129 MWh; according to https://www.tesla.com/en_AU/powerpack each power pack is
Length: 1,308 mm (51.5″)
Width: 822 mm (32.4″)
Height: 2,185 mm (86″)
Weight: 1622 kg (3575 lbs)
With each power pack having a capacity of 210 KWh, than means about 614 power packs. (I read somewhere it was 612, but I can’t find that now.)
In addition, there are Industrial Inverters (from 50kVA to 625kVA (at 480V)):
Length: 1,014 mm (39.9″)
Width: 1254 mm (49.4″)
Height: 2192 mm (86.3″)
Weight: 1200 kg (2650 lbs)
I have not attempted to calculate how many of those are needed.
Assuming no inverters, that’s 995,908 kg of Powerpacks. Or 996 tonnes.
So, are they coming by air? If so, 15 Airbus A330-200F (for example) trips.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cargo_aircraft#Comparisons
Or by sea? In which case, that would be about 1 month in transit. That will take a big chunk out of Musk’s “100 days or it’s free” promise.
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Bob,
You will NEVER get a job in Government.
THINKING is NOT allowed (even if someone shows some limited capability of being able to think).
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All batteries, whether they be lead acid or lithium, slowly lose their ability to store energy as they go through the charge/discharge/charge cycle. Over time, even Musk’s battery pack will not be able to deliver its total rated (brand new) capacity meaning that the shortfall will have to be made up from somewhere else. But since the green zealots haven’t got the 1st clue about this sort of thing, they will all join hands and sing “Kumbayah” and claim that it proves that renewables can provide all the answers. So the following will occur. 1) The battery will have to be replaced (at taxpayers expense) within a few years 2) Musk will walk away with $$ in his pocket. (He is after all, a businessman, in the business of making money out of”saving the planet”) and Wetherill has a short term solution to stopping his bleeding vote count. Oh… And the lights will still go out in S.A. next summer.
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I would say that not some , but most of our political shysters know all about the scam of global warming / climate change / or what ever else these BSers in suits call it this month.
‘They’re making money out of it….it’s that simple !’
They may not directly, but their families , friends, associates, and even their better/much better job prospects may contribute to their lack of resistance up to major advocacy, once they leave their pretense of public service !
The whole thing is an obvious scam , and all that advocate for such a racket are complicit !
The BSers are in Charge and they couldn’t care less about people freezing in winter and roasting in summer, because they can’t afford these ridiculous power price hikes .
We are now paying a great big new carbon tax by stealth, by deliberate power price hikes + GST .
Vote for One Nation , vote for CB’s ACs, vote for DL LDs and similar non gloBull warmers, is the only way to combat the scammers.
Don’t vote for any that advocate for any of the climate nonsense ! If everybody did this, the scam would die from the quick death it deserves.
Also what is this nonsense that some/most admit privately what they won’t say publicly?
How about : whatever you think about this privately , is what you should be stating publicly ? How about that ?
Because anything else is simply deceit(the party line), and should never be tolerated by the general public .
The so called ‘towing the party line’ , is an admission that their priorities are to keep their seats of deception and unjustifiable privilege , rather than do what is honest .
The excuse of ‘Vote for Us, because the others are worse’, simply doesn’t cut it .
Why do we have to put up with professional liars and scammers for our leaders and governing class?
It’s time for major votes for some minor parties, minus NX and DH ……that’ll rattle the tree of the so called and ridiculously claimed ‘Right Honorables’ !
The gloBull warming Swamp is upon us.
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