In 2017 in its last month of operation, the 53 year old Hazelwood coal plant was still operating reliably 24 hours a day at around $30/MWhr and producing 1360MW of electricity. Despite its age, it could peak at 86% of its original rated output.
After Hazelwood closed, wholesale prices jumped 85% in Victoria. And the annual average spot wholesale price in Victoria in the last year was $100/MWH.
So naturally Victoria wants to build more wind power, and blow up old reliable coal.
Every single week in January, when electricity demand peaks in Australia, there were days when one old coal plant could have provided more electricity than all 57 new wind farms on the National Electricity Market could.
How much did it cost to build 57 not-there-when-you-need-it wind farms?
The output of all the wind farms in Australia still isn’t enough to reliably produce more than one 50 year old coal plant.
In its lifetime Hazelwood made $15 billion dollars worth of electricity (or 520TWH). It paid for itself many times over.
Source: Anero.id
h/t David B, Serp
..
Just so painfulll to watch. I can’t say any more . .
GeoffW
330
No no no no…is glorious Soviet victory!!
All comrades must be in fight to win over evils of West power station – we wait on Glorious Leader to lead us to wisdom!
All hail Chairman Dan, leader of Supreme Soviet!!
380
Jo,
You forgot the A$500million it costs to “rehabilitate” the site. Could have been used to fix the power station.
The stupidity of all this is mind numbing.
Energy Australia’s Yallourn site is under the gun next. When it goes we will finally see unreliable power dominate Victoria.
Don’t expect Michael O’Brien (Liberal opposition leader), to have any different views. He will agree with a 16 year old (who does not vote) on Climate Change (I was at the meeting) before sticking his head up and going against socialist group think.
Weak kneed Liberals allow coal fired power stations to be blown up while hoping gas suppiers financed by offshore interests (China, Singapore, India, Japan, South Korea, Taiwan) will save them. Gas has been fighting with coal for 30 years. You have to get rid of cheap coal (owned by the state) in order to replace it with more expensive methane owned by other sovereigns.
Simply crank the price of coal royalties, tax the coal “emissions”, make the power unreliable and all will scream for gas turbines while equally being screamed at for unreliables like solar and wind.
Coal is cheap. We woould not be rich without it. It has allowed us to become stupid.
Worked everywhere else. Sure to work a treat even in Victoria (395 Billion tons of lignite on shore,
1,200 Billions tons offshore).
230
This is nothing for a government who spent $1.1 Billion (That’s with a B IE 1.1 THOUSAND MILLION dollars) to NOT BUILD A FREEWAY.
How he got reelected, together with known corruption in the ranks, I will never understand.
90
Its worse than you think Bob, the A$500 million was Engie Australia’s and Mitsui’s money, not the states. The electricity users pre-paid for it in their bills.
20
[Duplicate]AD
20
Very timely, in the context of Michael Moore’s expose of the “renewables” industry. The term “blood-sucking vampire squid” comes to mind.
Cheers,
Speedy
340
Truly insane act. You are not wrong about a good civilzation going to waste Jo.
320
You did not narrow down on it.
Let me offer a question.
Scenario: To make sure the asbestos cloud would travel as far as possible, the demolition was conducted when there was no rain to scrub the air clean?
Complete absence of strategic spraying of water into the air to dampen the asbestos dust cloud either that i could see? …did i not see that?
170
I had not watched this demolition film – too annoyed by the whole thing.
But your mention of there being asbestos in those chimneys made me go & look.
And yes there was meant to be lots of water to keep the asbestos dust down
In fact I think that is a legal obligation as the town of Churchill is 1 kilometer away with about 2000 people.
So E S thanks for bringing that to our attention.
And not having the curtain of water is a real legal cock up by who ever planned and executed the demolition job
152
And because the other buildings were not demolished first, each building will be heavily dusted, inside and out, with asbestos dust that when disturbed, will insure the rest of the demolition will continue to be a constant source of more asbestos dust that only needs to be disturbed slightly to disperse it further and longer than ever before.
Living next door to a solid, stable block of asbestos is one thing, living next door to a site that is covered in asbestos dust needs to have a more than a ten kilometer radius for safety in my non expert student opinion (IMNESO).
100
At the moment, the alleged safe distance is only 500 meters. Got to be kidding. At least ten kilometers (IMNESO). This is a disaster and and emergency in my opinion.
50
According to a spokesperson for the demolition team, there was a 37 meter high water spray curtain all around the site !
I looked, but could not see it either, and certainly the dust went much higher than 37 m.
Highly impractical to attempt to shedule a demolition on this scale to coincide with wet weather.
00
I agree Chad it would have been difficult and highly impractical for the EPA (environmental photography agency) to get good pics during rain events, however, i do know photographers can overcome the poor lighting conditions.
20
Sorry Environment Skeptic do not believe everything you hear or read especially if it is from a green socialist or ignorant journalist.There was no asbestos in those stacks which were made of concrete. If there was any asbestos (which is doubtful going back only 50 years by which time asbestos had been phased out) it would only be in lagging used for very hot parts around the boiler eg inspection ports.
I agree that there was no need to shut down Hazelwood in 2017. It was made uneconomic by government edicts to allow feed in from subsidised so-called renewables (which in fact are unreliables). However, once the plant has been shut down without mothballing or continuous maintenance for 3 years in which time oils and grease can solidify and have mould growing, parts can corrode, rain can get into buildings etc, the plant is not worth recovering. Most likely, some equipment (eg the turbines) will have been pulled out ans sold. The plant needs demolition like other building site before something new can be put in place. A good place to put a 2000MW Nuclear Power station with its cooling tower. They will take less space that the previous power station of smaller capacity.
50
And so your nuclear plant workers will be immunised against the flu so the storage ponds of spent fuel have have tradesmen there 24 seven to maintain the storage of spent fuel like in Fukushima. …..While we work out what we can do with all the spent fuel and how exactly the huge tailings dams of raw nuclear sewage can be contained in those nuclear sewage ponds ?
https://www.bhp.com/-/media/bhp/regulatory-information-media/copper/olympic-dam/0000/draft-eis-appendices/odxeisappendixf1tailingsstoragefacilitydesignreport.pdf
01
It’s what Labor Premiers do…but I’m not sure if Daniel Andrews is actually Labor.
A person called James Plested’s linked in descriptor says he’s …
‘Senior Policy Adviser at Department of Premier and Cabinet ‘ in Victoria
…and appears to be [ same photograph] the same person who’s a prolific writer and editor of RED FLAG which describes itself thus …
‘Red Flag is an Australian newspaper which is published bi-weekly by the Trotskyist organisation Socialist Alternative.’
‘Socialist Alternative is Australia’s largest Marxist organisation. We are building branches of student activists, union militants and movement campaigners around the country.’
Some of Plested’s comments from his many many articles…
‘Rebellion isn’t enough; we need revolution. As Guardian columnist George Monbiot recently commented, if we’re to have any hope of tackling an issue on the scale of climate change “we’ve got to go straight to the heart of capitalism and overthrow it”.’
‘There is no substitute for the hard work of revolutionary organising and education, and of the day to day participation in the struggles of workers and the oppressed’
No doubt he and Andrews would find much common ground with Xi…and not much with the rest of us.
150
Are you sure this ‘James Plested’ is not a nom de plume (pseudonym) of a certain Jacinda Ardern? His Red Rag writing/ranting is almost word-for-word verbatim of Dear Leader Cinders’ daily speeches to we lesser mortals ploughing the beet fields for greater good of New Norm*.
Surely Demolition Dan will be out there this morning with his broom and shovel cleaning up his UN-righteous toxic mess… no? Is there not a crime on your statute books that starts with a ‘T’ followed by ‘reason’? As Geoffrey at #1 stated, painful, and sad, very sad.
* Please keep the border of Victoria CLOSED – we don’t want any of those lunatics over here, there’s enough already. R.I.P.
80
I think their ‘organisation’ and ‘education’ has more sticking power these days.
I have relatives who are distraught about how hard-wired the Marxism their children have embraced at University is.
Ask what they’re studying and most often it’s journalism…media studies or something social-science-related…where their post-Uni influence is pervasive….as if there wasn’t already too much LW propaganda and too little objective information in the media.
40
RedFlag. A bunch of angry young men. All working for state governments. All on the public payrol. These people only become very dangerous when they are in rich families. All “successful” revolutionaries need someone else’s money. There are very few, less than 1%, self made people. Most inherit it all.
On the “read it before you comment front”, some of the Redflag articles have quite useful ideas. However, its the anger about society that comes across. They want to change stuff but are unwilling to actually do the work or pay for it.
I don’t mind a revolutionary who uses their money to do stuff. Very hard to find any though. Then there is the problem of integrity and honesty…..
60
Thank you for your admonition Geoff C.…
I have read many of Plested’s writings…and of course some truth is to be found amongst the jaundiced corruptions and blinkered views….there always is …even in the writings of some of history’s monsters.
Doesn’t matter to me what they think themselves…it’s all corrupted by their tunnel vision and selective interpretations….IMO.
But if you don’t think they’re influential …ie don’t have any influence on the lives and futures of the rest of us …I think you just have to look at Andrews’ Victoria and to a lesser extent[maybe] the other Labor states-with ‘safe schools’…gender reassignment of children with medical specialists in the field sidelined and threatened with litigation…even parents over-ruled…and children made available by LW teachers as audience and dupes for Gore and his CAGW travelling propaganda circus etc etc.
These are exactly the types of people who are to blame for the debacle that puts Australia near the bottom of world education rankings now.
I’ve been reading their proud Marxist education publications and hocus pocus for years…and seen their ‘new schemes’ puffed by the like-minded and the uninformed in the Australian media….and adopted ….to scramble the brains of yet another generation of Australian kids.
It’s all out and proud…it’s in the schools of all the Western democracies and is near impossible to dislodge because their victims ….the children…are programmed not just by teachers but by the LW journalists of the MSM …to think the teacher must be right….and anyway kids don’t want their parents straying from any role other than that of mum and dad…to disagree with a teacher.
In Germany it spawned the Bader-Meinhof gang of murderers and the horrors of the Kinderladen pedophile movement …as well as the Frankfurt school of education that spread its damaging influence worldwide.
Now even many ‘qualified’ teachers …unless they’ve been able to first teach themselves…are not proficient enough to teach grammar….or to make their own statements and teaching clear and unambiguous.
Every attempt by conservative governments to remedy this situation has been clobbered by the Left in all its iterations including teacher unions.
IMO as with everything …the media is the key …and Marxist academics are making sure the already incestuous media …where jobs for life are kept within the family…is increasingly stacked with their own product.
30
A comment on the news stated that Hazelwood was “The most polluting powerstaion in the southern hemisphere”.
No explaination of this statement, just take it as a fact!
160
Now that the asbestos is atomised to smithereens by the explosions into a fine talcum powder everywhere, it probably is the most toxic and polluting site in the SH.
130
Its like the Minions are in charge of the state…except they are Red Minions, not yellow ones…
160
Sack-rilege!
90
Hazelwood
RIP
You’ve done your job, well done.!!
It’s critically important that Liddel doesn’t close or until a new coal fired powerered stations is built
Need everyone to flood the federal and state energy ministers with emails
A petition anyone?
210
Excellent point.
Take some action.
80
Built in 1964, it had a good run. Remediation of the sit and the mine is expected to cost 750 million, and that is on top of the fines already paid by the owners after a fire, which they were slow to extinguish.
It was cheap, mostly because it’s true operating costs were externalised.
041
Peter it was cheap, reliable for its age and ran 24/7 .
It wasn’t shut down because it was broken it was shutdown to save the world from .000?CO2 emissions .
400
And that co2 levels continue to raise in spite of all the world closed down since March !
Just more proof it’s natural !
140
And, of all the CO2 in the atmosphere, about 96% is nature, and the remaining 4% is of human origin.
We humans are a pretty weak force.
70
And Peter, the word “its” does NOT require an apostrophe. Go to the back of the class, pick up that pointy hat with a big ‘D’ on it and place it on your head – the rest of the class want to LEARN.
50
🙂 🙂
That’s too sophisticated for that person.
It’s a fact that only real scientists could appreciate.
00
Um…they replace bits of a powerstation as they break, so its always being effectively upgraded…
210
Very thoughtful.
Very Functional.
So, Expressive.
30
Those external cost are only in your imagination.
And of course you forgot to mention the incredible BENEFITS from the CO2 released for plant life.
Even the coal ash is highly usable and exists in every concrete structure built.
At least the site will get remediated,
Wind turbine bases are FOREVER and they bury the chopped up remnants of toxic blades as refuse in ground fill to pollute forever.
And let’s not forget to mention the toxic pollution from degrading solar panels and the horrendous pollution in the manufacture of both wind turbines and solar panels.
Talk about externalised cost !!
390
Well said Andy,well said. The stupid idea that wind and solar can make up for it is already showings every Australian the mistake that has been made in the name of making things better for Australia.
140
For those who don’t know — Roy Hogue and Bite Back are one and the same. Both are nut cases not to be taken too seriously. Roy hogue was the moderator, AZ, who was a pain to Andy I’m sure.
10
🙂
00
“after a fire, which they were slow to extinguish”
You mean like these ??
https://secure.i.telegraph.co.uk/multimedia/archive/02079/turbine-new_2079144b.jpg
https://geekologie.com/2016/08/04/wind-turbine-fire.jpg
https://stopthesethings.files.wordpress.com/2013/01/wind_turbine_fire-e1401165093176.jpg
https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/proxy/aYedVQWfridSOupefGY5BSArh7BwT7oyrfY39x8OESMlYs0AO458gRjDQRZSGmGX0YPE2qe2NNOQ3l2LUe9p7pHrw8xcEtJUtaNWbW_gvQvpCExivUtCldN6
and I could post hundreds more links like that
140
Or perhaps like these?
https://media.apnarm.net.au/media/images/2012/02/01/solar_panel_fire_t1880.jpg
https://s3.amazonaws.com/jo.nova/photo/man-made/renewables/solar/walmart-fire-solar.jpg
https://ulfirefightersafety.org/assets/thumbnails/projects/photovoltaic/PV-12.jpg
140
Here’s another one
http://www.pvstop.com.au/wp-content/uploads/2016/08/Solar-Panel-Blase-in-Taunton-27.07.16.jpg
Do the solar companies (which has probably gone bankrupt through huge payments to the “owner”, then renamed themselves to start again) pay a fine for this?
Do wind farms pay a heavy fine for the highly toxic fire from wind turbine fires?…
… or do they get off scot-free like they do for killing endangered top-level bird-life?
210
Andy, great photos – I have seen many other ecocrucifix and solar disasters and cannot understand why they get very little media coverage. I do hope that Michael Moore’s latest film causes some of the rusted on alarmists to realise that the renewable emperor is wearing no clothes.
60
Peter today I’m ashamed to be a Victorian but even more ashamed to have people like you identifying as Australians.
70
The externalised costs included
Lower community health in the surrounding region
Pollution of waterways
Lower air quality
It’s easy to dismiss these, particularly when it does not effect you.
Still, since price is you main concern, adverse health and environmental outcomes mean nothing to you.
018
Unproven rubbish on all counts
Let’s not forget the HORRENDOUS environmental damage done during the manufacture of wind turbines and solar panels. Child-mining slavery, toxic pollution in China
It’s easy to dismiss these, its somewhere else, it does not effect you.
As well as the massive environmental and avian damage done by both.
Infrasound, avian munching and roasting, highly toxic smoke when either combusts.
Adverse health and environmental outcomes mean nothing to you.
And let’s not dismiss the economic strain of continued payments of subsidies and CO2 co-payments leading ALWAYS to increased electricity costs (glad you admitted that)
And the cost of upgrading the grid structure to cope with their unreliable intermittent behaviour.
Coal fire power GIVES,
Wind and solar TAKE..
Which is why you relate to them.
100
Fitz lives down the road from a couple of coal fired power stations and is genuinely concerned.
https://www.envirojustice.org.au/healthstudynsw/
21
Anyone can make up numbers using wonky fantasy statistics.
Let’s see them present names and actual cases with proof of cause.
Tantamount to statistical f***d.
30
Hilarious el gordo! So roughly speaking, Using the figures on that link, in Sydney coal power contributes to 0.003% more premature births, deaths and new diabetes cases in Sydney. I can see why alarmists are panicking.
20
The study was more an illustration how to use statistics to create your own non-data.
There is ZERO evidence any of the numbers put forward have any reality about them at all.
30
Doctors in the Hunter region called it a pack of arrant lies and mis-information.
30
There are no Sydney power stations.
Vales Point is the closest about 75km north
Lithgow (Mt Piper) and Eraring are the next closest, about 100km away (west and north)
Bayswater and Liddell are in the mid Hunter Valley, about 160km away (direct line)
40
These people affected by “adverse health” directly attributable to scrubber equipped Hazelwood — Please name them Peter?
30
Peter,
Regardless of externalities, real or imagined, it is one of the real examples of performance and costs that new competitors must beat for gains to society to happen.
Unreliable have some externalities too. What is the cost of birds killed by windmills?
Every proper comparison I have seen makes unreliable much more expensive at national scale, Germany a notable example. They have returned to some new brown coal plants. Why?
Geoff S
70
So, and despite all the assertions and evasions, a replacement brown coal plant was not, and will not be built.
Like horse drawn pumps in the mines, coal has had its day.
110
Politically, in Victoria, who will eventually suffer for the arrant stupidity and shortsightedness of the current anti-CO2 meme.
But on a global scale coal use is increasing and will continue to increase.
And there is nothing you can do about it.
70
‘ … coal has had its day.’
I live down the road from Mt Piper and know someone who works there, so let me be the first to inform you that coal is here to stay.
50
Regarding the remediations costs of Hazelwood, did you ever consider the money required to decommission and remove every wind turbine in the country today, which provides about the same average power output as one Hazelwood plant ?
The study below shows that to decommission one single turbine costs over USD$500k or about the cost of Hazelwood decommissioning in AUD$, noting that in Australia we have 101 wind farms with more than 10,000 turbines in total. You can do the maths.
https://www.instituteforenergyresearch.org/renewable/wind/the-cost-of-decommissioning-wind-turbines-is-huge/
Sometimes it’s better to stay silent 😉
50
It takes basic intelligence and common sense to know when NOT to say something stupid.
He doesn’t have either of those, and nearly always chooses to double-down
… especially when shown to be demonstrably WRONG..
ie 97% of the time.
30
Windpower is a formulated and premeditated scam. On the face of it, nobody makes any money out of this. The consumer pays more as prices rise. The government pay more, but with your money, they get some back but not enough to cover all the subsidies and additional network infrastructure. The only beneficiaries seem to be landowners and manufacturers. So what makes it worthwhile for the government? If you can answer that question, I’d be grateful.
150
You gotta be kidding.
10
The government gets elected!
10
Yep, buying votes with the voters own money. What a scam!
90
Since government never can create any wealth, with what can it buy votes but with your money.
Your money is the only money government can possibly have.
Government, no matter how good or bad, destroys wealth since it needs money but it does not create any wealth. Voters need to learn this and remember it when their government spends money.
BB
50
True,
And I suspect that California is the home of renewables.
One of my pet peeves about green wind is the hidden health issue of what’s wrongly called noise.
http://joannenova.com.au/2015/10/green-future-spain-adds-solar-tax-has-punished-the-wind-industry-all-up-has-lost-65000-renewable-jobs/#comment-1755867
KK
20
This is a response to one of my earlier comments.
I’m amazed at how conciliatory I was but it may have been before large numbers of people began to complain about turbine related illnesses.
The person writing this has No qualifications that would give him the perspective and knowledge to deal with vlf pulsing.
On re reading it there is the obvious misrepresentation of people’s unhappiness as just grumpiness rather than something very real that is related to constant nausea from turbines.
The responses from others to his comment are much better than mine.
http://joannenova.com.au/2015/10/green-future-spain-adds-solar-tax-has-punished-the-wind-industry-all-up-has-lost-65000-renewable-jobs/#comment-1755881
KK
20
BB,
Not always.
There was a $$$ benefit to Australia after our government invested taxes in keeping the Japs from invasion in WWII.
Maybe you are thinking more of the many problems that arise when govt spends on matters that the people do not want them involved. Like using tax dollars to help educate masses of foreign students whose interests in a future Australia might not match yours and are done without ways for you to state your preferences. Geoff S
20
“The only beneficiaries seem to be landowners and manufacturers”
You gotta be kidding! The corruption within the politicians associated with wind farms is all through state and federal govt, and at the highest levels.
It is a family sport from one of our recent prime ministers.
https://www.theage.com.au/national/cbd-melbourne-a-peek-over-alex-s-hedge-fund-20190124-p50th8.html
The NSW dept planning is corrupt as anything and so is the process of approval.
What I found recently, being one of these landowners who might have benefited (really is not a benefit, never met a land owner with wind towers on their place who didnt wish in the end they had nothing to do with them), but wont have anything to do with these corrupt so and so’s, is that 1/2 the wind farms that exist are not even properly connected to the grid, and never will be. They get approved and built anyway despite it being obvious to the planning department there is no appropriate grid connection. There is lots of money to be made in the application process for those that propose the wind farms, then “consult” on the approval and development process, wether the development goes ahead or not. Financiers make money lending it to proposed developments, and I think also in big electricity companies, some of whom are Chinese owned now, get tax write offs for indulging in “carbon” saving expenditures and probably obligatory “sustainability” targets. There are so many mouths on so many tits at so many levels in the wind farm industy.
170
Yes of course, that’s what I was inferring, sorry that my sarcasm didn’t come off.
40
Jane,
That’s a great fill in. So many ways to benefit apart from the most obvious end points, manufacturers and landowners.
The ugliest part of the whole thing for the landowners is the deliberately hidden issue of VLF pulsing which tears people apart. I’ve posted on this in the past. The issue is described as “noise” to dismiss the real human damage being done to landowners and their neighbours. Heavy vehicle drivers operating trains and mining equipment are prime targets for I’ll health associated with VLF pulsing.
KK
20
Earlier cold comment.
http://joannenova.com.au/2019/11/an-unpowered-invisibility-cloak/#comment-2226360
00
Immoderate
00
A bit on vlf pulsing.
http://joannenova.com.au/2018/11/wind-turbines-are-new-top-predator-in-the-ecosystem/#comment-2067307
20
The biggest organ in the body.
http://joannenova.com.au/2016/03/its-irresponsible-to-research-health-effects-of-wind-farms-says-prof-chapman/#comment-1793415
20
Proof that nothing has changed. No matter, things will get interesting when people start getting angry at all our governments for sacrificing our economy to a cult.
80
The only way that realisation can occur is if social security is seriously reduced to make an incentive for people to work.
For many there’s a good lifestyle on Soc Sec and politicians are happy cause they can influence potential voters with a strategic incease just before the election.
KK
32
Hazellwood is in the Latrobe Valley in Gippsland in Victoria.
The Latrobe valley used once to have ~ 30,000 power industry jobs.
It was a prosperous active part of Victoria.
Labor since 1996 has presided over the reduction of those power industry jobs to a couple of thousand now.
Meanwhile the working people of the Valley has gone on the scrap heap with just Centerlink to pay for essentials.
And the value of houses has dropped catastrophically as well.
I knew a former friend who was jubilant about being able to buy a three bedroom home in the Latrobe Valley for $45,000.
I looked at it. There was nothing wrong with and it had a big block.
In Melbourne the same would now be worth $5-600,000
But in the Latrobe Valley which Labor has destroyed -just knock off a zero at the end.
( the same fate awaits the Hunter Valley when the coal fired plants are closed there )
PS : The Latobe Valley used once to be a safe labor seat. Now the Nationals & independents fight it out to hold the local seat
61
In case you haven’t noticed it yet, the Western economies including the US are heading the other way – more socialism, more government handouts, more digital money “printing”. The comment was made recently in the US they are prepared to “print” as much as possible to forestall a depression. That could mean as much as $50 trillion if necessary. Of course that will only postpone the inevitable crash and burn. They have been doing it now for decades. Can’t last forever.
31
‘Can’t last forever.’
Not sure about that, welcome to the new world order. I put it to you that our federal sphere, dominated by the major parties, should be scrapped, leaving us with local councils and states. Do you think that might work?
30
How stupid is Australia. Blowing up perfectly good coalfired power stations and then sending BILLIONS of dollars to CHINA to buy solar panels and wind turbines. At the same time destroying any hope of restablishing manufacturing in Australia because of expensive unreliable ruinables. The CCP are laughing their heads off. How DUMB is Australia.
340
Processing poly silicon is very energy intensive. Ironically, Coal power makes that practical.
60
Fifty percent of the world’s coal fired power stations are in China and there is talk of over capacity, so the CCP would like to build a new coal plant in Victoria to support commie Dan’s VFT network. Both to be built on the never never system.
00
[Duplicate]AD
00
Was it Serp who put up the original link for this.
I couldn’t watch it, but now I’ve had a drink it’s been viewed.
What has politics become: a haven for people who have the skills of a Goebels; people who have a dream, a vision that has no connection with reality.
Another great post , because it is short, sharp and to the point.
The alternative to replace this demolished plant is:
More Expensive per kWh.
Less “Green” in the construction ; wind or solar.
More deadly pollution in mining and extraction processes.
Earlier coal fired plants were polluting, but the removal of chemicals and particulates in modern plants is superb.
Although CO2 per kWh is irrelevant, for the record, the overall process in getting wind/solar electricity to the user is Not CO2 Efficient. Paradoxical but true.
Modern coal fired plants create less CO2 per kWh.
But forget all that. It’s the beliefs and votes that count.
Just ask all the voters in Tony Abbott’s former seat.
KK
110
There are dumbnuts in every government of every party.
But why is it that Labor has such a huge proportion of them ?
Port Augusta in SA power station was shut down by Labor in 2015
And created the conditions that lead to ‘system black’ in September 2016.
That destroyed Labor & Weatherall in March 2018.
Now Labor in Victoria has done the same folly.
System black is a coming to Victoria
And if the bloody Liberals & nationals can get their act together
Labor will be consigned to the rubbish bin of history there as well.
81
How virtuous the activists must feel!
Now coal will be sold to the Chinese to burn to provide the energy to make the materials for windmills and solar panels.
The consumer will have to pick up the bill for the Chinese cost of manufacture, and pay three times the price for their electricity.
What price virtue, and how much CO2 will be saved?
The wind is hardly blowing today in the UK too.
110
Actually no Stephen P. Hazelwood used Brown coal ( lignite ) and the Chinese do not want or use brown coal.
The Chinese onlly want black coal from NSW or Qld.
What remains in the ground will just stay there now unused forever.
At least that is the green labor plan for the open cut mine there.
32
Maybe now that the CCP has been exposed as complete dictatorial bully
People will stop buying ‘made in China’ stuff
i hope so.
41
[Duplicate]AD
00
Kind of reminds me of this…( funny movie, too…)
https://youtu.be/6srI0EVwTUE
20
The question no one has asked, can Victoria do a black start when the grid goes down because of lack of wind?
Maybe the government will have to invest in some really large diesel generators just to keep the lights on or are they expecting industry and most of the population to do that?
100
A pity they didn’t save the generators, which might have been turned into Synchronous Converters (unlike SA where they have had to buy new ones after blowing up their coal fired stations). Still it’s only $160 million extra there (on top of the Big Battery, the new diesels and those CO2 emitting diesel/gas burning short term covering ‘peakers’).
The first cost with renewables is the least cost.
50
The batteries are just a UPS to cover for the start up of the Diesel Gensets.
70
They still have two brown coal power plants operating.
Morwell ! & 2.
Whether they could do a black start if a system black happened is unknown.
11
I think you mean Loy Yang A and B. Heaven help Victoria if, sorry when, they ever close
60
Our son in East Gippsland reckons it’s already ‘when’ for at least one of them.
50
AT the current time (0710 am 26-05-20) 68% of Victoria’s power is still coming from brown coal powered generators. https://reneweconomy.com.au/nem-watch/
40
5pm AEST…. 3 most populous states.
NSW 93% of electricity coming from COAL
VIC 71% coming from COAL & GAS 21% hydro
QLD 78% COAL 18% GAS…. wind 0%
20
One supposes that enough businesses people, understanding the risk of an unstable power grid, will leave
that the power system will survive, allowing those who believe in “science” to say “I told you so”
sitting in genteel poverty in their once first world neighborhood.
30
After watching something on Sky about Dictator Dan and his BRI, I also saw the sickening news of the destruction of Hazelwood. I commented to my husband that the CCP must be laughing like drains at the useful idiot and his cronies. The money (ours, Chairman Dan) that is spent on subsidising the Ch1nese equipment for wind and solar when we should be producing our own goods, made with our own cheap, plentiful, coal-fired power is beggaring the state, which is then going to be further in hock to Ch!na through the BRI.
What the dickens has happened to Australia; how did a larrikin country become so stuffed with useful idiots?
160
Great for China. Render your enemy helpless. Take control.
ALP; friends of fentanyl, death camps, viruses, and debt invasion.
Oh, and blowing up power stations.
110
Remember this from Jo :
http://joannenova.com.au/2017/03/hazelwood-countdown-53-years-old-and-making-more-electricity-than-australias-entire-wind-industry/#more-53276
So sad I had tears . For their last month those loyal turbines gave their all without interruption , something the ruinables could never do even when brand new .
Reliable power 24/7 for $30/MWh replaced with intermittent power for $180/MWh ( plus the cost of backup ) .
There is no limit to the evil of Marxism .
Now Commo Dan can hand over the ruins of his state to the CCP when he signs his secret Belt & Road deal with the communists .
Treason . Those politicians responsible should be classified as enemy combatants and locked up in a POW camp .
We must not forget what they did !
140
Daniel Andrews is a sleeper agent for the Chinese Communist Party.
130
Correct.
40
There is no “sleep” in it by looks of things….
30
I went to Australia in 2011-2012 with a new product that makes coal plants produce electricity more efficiently and with lower pollutants.
Net savings from using the product was about 10% of fuel cost plus lower maintenance and cleaner air.
You guessed it: no interest at all. We even offered the product at no risk (no cost if it didn’t save fuel in excess of its cost.)
Instead they threw away billions on unreliable wind rubbish.
Looting idiots. BTW, Australians are not unique in this idiocy.
110
A friend designed and produced such a product, tested and proven in Govt.laboratories. It was offered to the coal powered generators in WA. It was apposed by the union that represents coal miners as it would reduce the requirement for coal. It was subsequently rejected. The product is now used in tens of thousands of wood fired domestic heaters throughout Australia.
80
Last one out of Victoriastan turn out the lights.
Oh , wait … there are no lights …
Victoria’s largest solar project, Kiamal is a total mess.
Grid connection has been delayed by almost a year, local subcontractors have not been paid and the managing contractor from Greece has fled the country, abandoning 5 other solar projects.
https://reneweconomy.com.au/biosar-paid-40-million-to-extract-itself-from-delayed-australian-solar-projects-33599/
60
As I keep saying, if solar was a goer then its proponents would be able to point to a host of successful installations –they don’t.
30
Some history …
24 March 2017: Hazelwood power station closure: Tony Abbott urges Malcom Turnbull to intervene to save electricity plant
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-03-24/abbott-to-turnbull-step-in-and-save-hazelwood-power-plant/8382612
30
Audrey Zibelman wanted to be rid of it and then Dan obliged by tripling the coal royalties thus rendering the plant uneconomic; I keep wondering what sort of royalty applies to the lignite used in the hydrogen venture and suspect it’s been gifted.
00
Can only imagine the hard-ons this would give the ‘green movement’!
The irony of these huge phallic-like towers coming down while simultaneously giving said greens a hard-on, is not lost on me.
RIP cheap reliable power.
20
Okay when the this dispicable act was being shown on national television I checked the entire output of Victoria’s windfarms .They were producing a little over 400 megawatts
and their name plate capacity is supposed to be 2346 megawatts .Yeh but that C02 “polluting” Hazelwood coal fired power station could only produce 1600 megawatts
24/7 for 365 days a year .And the cost per megawatt oh only about one sixth of the cost of renewables.Yeh but what does that matter to corrupt Dan and crony capitalist
with vested interests in wind farms ?I suppose the thousands of energy poverty Victorians would be cheering on this horribly sad spectacle.
60
“Daniel Andrews is a sleeper agent for the Chinese Communist Party.”
Brian, I fear that you are right.
Daniel Andrews is also the enabler for the soft police service in Victoria. African gangs terrorising neighbourhoods get little or no response from our socialist premier and the police, but people sitting on a park bench or walking in the park incur draconian fines, with a swarm of police descending on them and issuing $1,652 fines.
Driving a car at high speed through Bourke Street and killing adults and children, well, Daniel Andrews’ police were told to hold back and watch. In that instance, it took two civilians to bring down the miscreant.
In 2018, the Andrews’ government was accused of rorting the electoral system with its ‘Red Shirt’ scam. The newspapers yelled loudly, but the debacle disappeared the next day. Nothing to see there. Funny that.
Daniel Andrews’ police were then instructed to pursue Cardinal Pell on numerous charges of paedophilia. When none of those charges stood up, Daniel Andrews’ police were instructed to find more charges, at a cost of millions of dollars to the taxpayer. None of those charges stood up either.
Speaking of paedophilia, Daniel Andrews legislated that all state schools in Victoria would promote the vile, perverted ‘Safe Schools’ anti-bullying program, despite the fact that the designer of the program, Ros Ward, admitted in a video that the program had nothing to do with bullying and was all about gender transitioning. Topics in the program included breast-binding and penis tucking. This program was presented to primary school children in state schools.
Unsurprisingly, Daniel Andrews sends his kids to a Catholic school, where the ‘Safe Schools’ perversity isn’t promoted. Funny that.
And now we have Daniel Andrews’ tour de force. His sell-out of Victoria to China.
This won’t affect me and my family. we are all too old, but this will effect future generations. Blowing out a state debt from 25 billion to 70 billion is bad enough, but what other hooks does the Chinese Communist Party have into Victoria, Australia?
This is frightening and should be stopped.
100
I heard something on Sky last night –I’m not sure if I understood it correctly. I think they said that Andrews signed up Victoria to the Belt and Road development without it going through the State Government. Is that correct and would it be a legal thing for him to do?
40
UK
“Wind farms paid record £.9.3m to switch off their turbines on Friday”
https://wattsupwiththat.com/2020/05/25/wind-farms-paid-record-9-3m-to-switch-off-their-turbines-on-friday/
Nice little earner there! Wonder how the nice little payers feel?
70
Alan Finkel, Australian Chief Scientist, 25 May, abc Q&A:
“Maybe 20 or 30 years from now we’ll have new kinds of batteries, vastly powerful, more extensive batteries and we can do it with batteries.”
Chief Scientist clashes with Lucy Turnbull over ‘shipping sunshine’
https://www.smh.com.au/national/chief-scientist-clashes-with-lucy-turnbull-over-shipping-sunshine-20200525-p54wbs.html
30
Hilarious to read “Ms Turnbull and Dr Finkel clashed over Australia’s pathway to net zero emissions by 2050”; Finkel has the outlook of a nineteenth century huckster and was never an appropriate choice for the role. That such a pathway cannot exist is beyond the ken of spivs and fabians innit?
40
OMG, the chemistry of batteries is well known and Lithium ION has about the best energy density possible, except maybe for Aluminium-air. Efficiency of battery technology is already over 90%. Finkel our Chief scientist says that somehow some scientific miracle might happen to make batteries more effective? – What exactly is that Alan?, how exactly are to going to violate the laws of the universe to do this? fairy dust batteries that magically give out more than you put in? Maybe unicorn horn electrolyte might work Al?
I can’t believe the scientific ignorance of our Chief scientist. Alan, we are already there – short of nuclear batteries there are few gains to be made to battery technology.
50
Seems to fit here too
“Stupidity is a more dangerous enemy of the good than malice”
“Dietrich Bonhoeffer’s Warning – 2020 Pandemic Lockdown Edition”
http://www.smalldeadanimals.com/index.php/2020/05/25/dietrich-bonhoeffers-warning-2020-pandemic-lockdown/
20
Big spinning machines arrive in South Australia to hasten demise of gas generation
Two synchronous condensers, or syncons, will be installed near the Davenport sub-station near Port Augusta, and two others will be installed near Robertstown, where a major new transmission line is planned to link South Australia’s renewables-dominated grid with NSW.
The syncons are considered essential because they will help solve a “system strength” shortfall declared by the Australian Energy Market Operator in 2017.
https://reneweconomy.com.au/big-spinning-machines-arrive-in-south-australia-to-hasten-demise-of-gas-generation-64767/
50
Destroy the power system with unreliables
And then waste millions of dollars stabilising it again
With big spinning things that ‘absorb’ intermittent and unstable wind power.
This is ideological madness.
And it is power users who are forced to pay for all the “waste*.
71
I dont believe these “Synchrons” actually adsorb power…not in the sense of storing significant energy like a battery would….but they provide “System stability” services such as frequency control.
They certainly will do nothing for the power shortages when the wind outputs drops to SFA !
..and neither will the expanded “BigBattery” . !!
30
Travis,
Lookup what a synchronous condensor does. Its two functions are voltage stability and Power function correction (supplying reactive power). If you need watts these devices actually consume a small amount but don’t supply normal power (resistance)
10
8.00 a.m., Melbourne , Victoria. The day after the big bang – foggy ( no solar ), dead calm ( no wind ) Listen to the ‘experts?’
70
Federal Energy Minister Angus Taylor has released a Technology Investment Roadmap. It is a bureaucratic discussion paper – yet read the disclaimer: The Commonwealth of Australia, its officers, employees, or agents disclaim any liability, including liability for negligence, loss howsoever caused, damage, injury, expense or cost incurred by any person as a result of accessing, using or relying upon any of the information or data in this publication.
The request for stakeholder submissions is an invitation for all rent seekers to put their hands out. Written submissions should be provided at https://consult.industry.gov.au/ by Sunday, 21 June 2020.
“Technology will drive a successful shift to secure, more affordable energy and lower emissions.” Yet there is nothing about more affordable energy. It keeps stating that if we keep researching these “low emission technologies” we might drive down their costs to where they are competitive.
The paper says that a goal is improving energy affordability, but most of the discussion is about reducing emissions. Recent Government initiatives – including the $1 billion Grid Reliability Fund, and the commitment of $500 million to a National Hydrogen Strategy – do nothing to make energy more affordable.
“On a pure energy collection and generation basis, solar and wind costs are projected to be cheaper than new thermal generation over all time horizons to 2050, but the cost of firming is still a major issue.” In other words, those ‘ruinables” are not cheaper.
“If significant cost reductions in energy storage are realised, careful and systematic deployment of low-cost renewable generation could re-establish our advantage in energy-intensive manufacturing.” More wishful thinking.
“The Australian Government has already invested $10.4 billion into more than 670 clean energy projects with a total project value in excess of $35 billion. These projects include the largest pumped hydro scheme in the southern hemisphere (Snowy 2.0), hydrogen demonstration projects, electric vehicle charging networks, and biofuels production. These investments are stimulating innovation, supporting new jobs and improving the reliability of our energy supply while lowering emissions.” Once again, nothing about making energy more affordable.
I see that Dr Finkel is still involved – his 2017 paper is the only place where I have seen some calculated costs of electricity generation in Australia:
New coal $76/MWhr
Solar with 12 hours storage $172/MWhr
Wind without backup $92/MWhr. (so add duplicate gas investment, or pumped hydro or batteries to that cost).
Gas $83/MWhr.
10
Hey Robber.
Just to add to this point….
The Hornsdale “big Battery” is currently being increased in capacity by 64.5MWh ( total will be 195MWh ) at a cost of $71m.. or $1.1m per MWh !
Compared to the original 129 MWh system at a reported cost of $90m..,or $0.7 m per MWh , 4 years ago ?
So there does not seem to be much of a trend in cost reduction for battery storage !.
20
The biggest tragedy of this is that Hazelwood was in better condition when shut down than Liddell was (and certainly better than Liddell is now).
The argument that Hazelwood was only providing cheap power because it was paid off years back ignores the long operating lifetime of properly maintained thermal power stations, unlike renewable generators that struggle to meet their specified lifespans.
Additionally, thermal plants will hold their rated output with proper maintenance while degradation is unavoidable with renewable generators, since the components that degrade are either the main cost (solar panels) or too difficult to replace (turbine blades)
As always, hydro is the exception for renewable generators and should be assessed in the same light as thermal generators.
20
Good news (sarcasm), an offshore wind farm for the Victoria coastline is planned, a Danish company is the applicant, and the promotional material claims it would provide “up to” 18 per cent of Victoria baseload energy.
Really?
Or would that be AEMO Capacity Factor 30 per cent of 18 per cent being 5.4 per cent on average when the wind blows?
10
So, who is paying for the demolition and rehab of the site? Is it ENGIE, who were the past operators? My guess probably the taxpayer. If it is ENGIE, then maybe this presents a new opportunity to build a HELE plant utilising the same hundreds of years of coal supply. If an entity had purchased the site back in 2017 they would have been responsible for the demo and rehab. Now, not. I’m thinking glass half full here.
00
Australia’s 911, The Greens are the new Reds!
China is building 200 Airports
China has 121 gigawatts of coal plants under construction, which is more than is being built in the rest of the world combined.
Japan to build up to 22 new coal power plants despite climate emergency?
20